1. Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 28, 2012
- 4348 views
I happen to go a whole day Hackputer session at Seneca College (yrok University, Toronto) - a session devoted to Raspberry Pi. Here are a few things that came to light. Please remember that I am not a Linux person.
1. The processor in Raspberry Pi is a level 6 ARM. Ubuntu is designed to support the level 7 processor inherent in most of the current tablets. 2. Debian is supportive of Level 2 onwards ARM processors. 3. They at Seneca College are working on a Fedora based release Linux for Raspbian PI
4. A Debian based release of Linux known as "Raspbian" works very well on Raspberry Pi.
http://www.raspbian.org/
http://liliputing.com/2012/07/raspbian-linux-now-available-for-raspberry-pi-up-to-40-percent-faster-than-debian.html
Raspbian Linux now available for Raspberry Pi: Up to 40 percent faster than Debian.
http://www.geek.com/articles/chips/overclocked-raspberry-pi-running-raspbian-os-is-lightning-quick-20120713/
Overclocked Raspberry Pi running Raspbian OS is lightning quick.
In a second stream, CUDA on Nvidia processor for development is highly recommended and praised.
2. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 28, 2012
- 4260 views
- Last edited Oct 30, 2012
By the way, the Raspberry Pi are still in short supply.
I paid my deposit at the student bookstore and have been promised one in the next 2 weeks.
Also I forgot to mention that they now come with 512MB memory as standard.
3. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 30, 2012
- 4257 views
For the Euphoria developers wanting to put Euphoria on the Raspberry map.
Tiny Basic Interpreter has just been announced for Raspberry PI.
http://www.staff.city.ac.uk/afl/tinybasic/downloads.html
There are some examples available at:
http://www.staff.city.ac.uk/afl/tinybasic/examples.html
Everything said to be working on wheezy-raspbian dated 2012-10-28:
http://downloads.raspberrypi.org/download.php?file=/images/raspbian/2012-10-28-wheezy-raspbian/2012-10-28-wheezy-raspbian.zip
Wheezy also wheezies well with the latest 512MB Model B of Raspberry PI.
4. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Oct 30, 2012
- 4199 views
By the way, the Raspberry Pi are still in short supply.
I paid my deposit at the student bookstore and have been promised one in the next 2 weeks.
Also I forgot to mention that they now come with 512K memeory as standard.
How does tinybasic run on 512K of memory?
useless
5. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 30, 2012
- 4283 views
By the way, the Raspberry Pi are still in short supply.
I paid my deposit at the student bookstore and have been promised one in the next 2 weeks.
Also I forgot to mention that they now come with 512K memeory as standard.
How does tinybasic run on 512K of memory?
useless
I am not too familiar with the product. You can try any of the above URLs. or try
http://www.golem.de/news/elternkompatibel-tinybasic-one-fuer-raspberry-pi-1210-95381.html According to them and I am quoting:
"Für den Raspberry Pi gibt es nun auch einen Basic-Interpreter. Tinybasic One soll mehr Leuten die Beschäftigung mit der für die Lehre und für Hobbyprojekte entwickelten Minicomputer-Platine ermöglichen - inklusive abschaltbarem Goto-Befehl."
You will probably understand that better.
6. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Oct 30, 2012
- 4212 views
By the way, the Raspberry Pi are still in short supply.
I paid my deposit at the student bookstore and have been promised one in the next 2 weeks.
Also I forgot to mention that they now come with 512K memeory as standard.
How does tinybasic run on 512K of memory?
useless
I am not too familiar with the product. You can try any of the above URLs. or try
http://www.golem.de/news/elternkompatibel-tinybasic-one-fuer-raspberry-pi-1210-95381.html According to them and I am quoting:
"Für den Raspberry Pi gibt es nun auch einen Basic-Interpreter. Tinybasic One soll mehr Leuten die Beschäftigung mit der für die Lehre und für Hobbyprojekte entwickelten Minicomputer-Platine ermöglichen - inklusive abschaltbarem Goto-Befehl."
You will probably understand that better.
No, actually, i do not understand why they "disconnected" goto.
This is more relavant to the 512K of memory you mentioned: "Viel Platz belegt es nicht: Die Distributionsdatei ist nur 66 KByte groß." but it doesn't tell me if 66K is left for Basic, after installing the OS and drivers and such, or if the Basic installer uncompresses to more than 66K, or how much ram the variables eat.
useless
7. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 30, 2012
- 4233 views
No, actually, i do not understand why they "disconnected" goto.
Probably because you had to go to Germany. Sprechen Sie Deutsch?
This is more relavant to the 512K of memory you mentioned: "Viel Platz belegt es nicht: Die Distributionsdatei ist nur 66 KByte groß." but it doesn't tell me if 66K is left for Basic, after installing the OS and drivers and such, or if the Basic installer uncompresses to more than 66K, or how much ram the variables eat.
useless
The variables do not eat Ram, children eat candy and Pumpkin Pi.
There seem to be a lot of Raspberry Pi + pumpkin projects around at the moment. Can’t think why.
If you install the Raspbian linux on a new Raspberry PI, you WILL be able to install Tiny Basic. Maybe, you have the older model; that's why you have problems. Since YOU are genuinely interested, I would suggest you leave the useless projects you might be working on and look at this Pumpkin Pi project with Raspberry Pi
http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/2282
or if you like dragons in Pumpkin Pi, then you have this:
https://projects.drogon.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/halloween1.jpg
Like this "Raspberry Pi motorized Halloween candy machine" which is quite ingenious, and great fun to develop in time for Haloween.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68j8tu7rS3k&feature=player_embedded
What is more relevant to the readers of the forum is your progress with Euphoria on Raspberry Pi. I am waiting for your high tech development of Euphoria on Raspberry PI, because I am expecting a Raspberry PI in a week or so. I look at the Archives everyday to see what you have come up with.
8. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Oct 30, 2012
- 4176 views
No, actually, i do not understand why they "disconnected" goto.
Probably because you had to go to Germany. Sprechen Sie Deutsch?
The whole German site did not explain why they dropped goto, but then added 10 other flow control keywords. Nein, ich spreche kein Deutsch.
This is more relavant to the 512K of memory you mentioned: "Viel Platz belegt es nicht: Die Distributionsdatei ist nur 66 KByte groß." but it doesn't tell me if 66K is left for Basic, after installing the OS and drivers and such, or if the Basic installer uncompresses to more than 66K, or how much ram the variables eat.
useless
The variables do not eat Ram, children eat candy and Pumpkin Pi.
Variables do consume memory, and at a surprising rate in some programming languages.
What is more relevant to the readers of the forum is your progress with Euphoria on Raspberry Pi. I am waiting for your high tech development of Euphoria on Raspberry PI, because I am expecting a Raspberry PI in a week or so. I look at the Archives everyday to see what you have come up with.
I do not have a Pi. Nor will i consider buying one as long as i have unanswered questions about it, or need to find answers on non-english sites. After all, not even YOU can tell me about the 512K of ram YOU mentioned.
useless
9. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 30, 2012
- 4176 views
I do not have a Pi. Nor will i consider buying one as long as i have unanswered questions about it, or need to find answers on non-english sites. After all, not even YOU can tell me about the 512K of ram YOU mentioned.
useless
As I said, I am still waiting for mine. In the meantime, surely, an expert like you and a long standing and most senior developer of Euphoria, can put together Euphoria for Raspberry Pi that can generate Pumpkin Pi for the coming Halloween, or at least a candy dispensing machine that I gave the URL of.
Forgive me for misunderstanding you before. I thought you were not English speaking, because you did not seem to grasp simple facts about Raspberry Pi or its tremendous acceptance in the educational world, or its tremendous demand, or the voracious appetite of Professors and teachers who buy Raspberry Pi by the 50s and 100s.
I am looking forward to your forthcoming release of Euphoria on Raspberry Pi.
10. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jaygade Oct 30, 2012
- 4160 views
Why are you asking useless_ to do your work for you for no consideration?
11. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 30, 2012
- 4208 views
Why are you asking useless_ to do your work for you ...........?
Because in many threads he has shown a unique ability and understanding of Euphoria, more than all the developers put together.
..... for no consideration?
Because I find that all the other developers are doing work "for no consideration"
12. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by _tom (admin) Oct 30, 2012
- 4217 views
I followed the link given previously:
http://www.staff.city.ac.uk/afl/tinybasic/downloads.html
I followed their instructions and compiled a 75KB executable. The download includes a version that runs on DOS and is 14.4KB .
The authors of this version decided that a "goto is bad" and hacked to code to remove the goto and added some other flow control statements.
It's all in English!
TOM
13. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by Lnettnay Oct 30, 2012
- 4169 views
Just FYI, useless is a female.
Lonny
14. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jaygade Oct 30, 2012
- 4183 views
Then you don't understand open source development very well.
Developers on open source projects develop solutions to scratch their own itch, whether it be due to direct utility or just because it is an interesting problem. They don't generally do so because someone else finds it interesting.
useless_ is very good at developing the projects which she finds interesting.
Others here have found ARM development of Euphoria to be interesting and have developed some code that will run on ARM. You might check that out, there is a development branch.
15. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 30, 2012
- 4152 views
The authors of this version decided that a "goto is bad" and hacked to code to remove the goto and ..................
It's all in English!
TOM
Somewhere I read that the GOTO was "switchable". Anyway, there seems to be a lot of concern about the GOTO command, because people are writing unreadable spaghetti code with that statement.
I am glad you explained it all in English for the questioner to understand.
16. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Oct 31, 2012
- 4153 views
I am looking forward to your forthcoming release of Euphoria on Raspberry Pi.
This will happen when 4.1.0 is released.
If this thread marks the day that TinyBasic was ported to Raspberry Pi, then I'd like to point out that we ran on the Pi first.
17. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by mattlewis (admin) Oct 31, 2012
- 4204 views
I do not have a Pi. Nor will i consider buying one as long as i have unanswered questions about it, or need to find answers on non-english sites. After all, not even YOU can tell me about the 512K of ram YOU mentioned.
Please drop this thread of questioning. It was obviously a typo. He meant 512MB. I can't prove that you knew this, but can be annoyed by troll-like activity on a common sort of typo that's so easy to resolve (one post: snark, multiple posts: trolling).
Matt
18. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 31, 2012
- 4140 views
I am looking forward to your forthcoming release of Euphoria on Raspberry Pi.
This will happen when 4.1.0 is released.
If this thread marks the day that TinyBasic was ported to Raspberry Pi, then I'd like to point out that we ran on the Pi first.
I don't think it is a matter of who did what first.
Euphoria is generally available on Kubuntu/Ubunto and a couple of other distros using many computers. Raspberry Pi did not have very good Lunix on it till wheezy version with Rapbian - so, yes, euphoria was ahead even with Linux.
Euphoria is NOT available yet available on ARM processors comfortably - and definitely not on ARM 7 version which is the current release of ARM processors. I have already pointed out that the current Raspberry Pi is not comfortable with the many popular releases of Linux because they all support ARM ver 7 and the Raspberry Pi is currently built with ARM6.
Euphoria is definitely NOT available on Raspbian, the trusted version of Linux on Raspberry Pi - the one which would make the army of users of Raspberry Pi to start working with Euphoria. The version of Fedora which Seneca College (York U., Toronto) are working on is Fedora 17 and they intend to make it compatible for use on Raspberry PI. I heard a talk by the guy who is working on it and he is still going round and round in circles. Last week he said he will have it ready in 2-3 weeks! (seemed more like 3 months to me)
Perhaps the people at Raspberry Pi will release a newer Raspberry Pi using ARM-V7. There are a couple of companies working on a ARM design incorporating network hardware on the ARM chip, and these people at Seneca seem to have some industry support and I sensed (in a lecture given by the prof) Professorial inclination to go towards their direction. If they do, it will be a Fedora 17 or 18 version and built in complete network and server support working on Raspberry Pi. It is a tall order, but unlike people like you all working under Open Source platform without pay, these people have some financial support from the industry and also from University funding.
I am merely bringing in some information which might be helpful to you all. As I have said before, I am not a Linux person, nor am I a C or C plusplus or C# or F# fan. I do like Euphoria and that is why I am here. And I do like wxWidgets and am waiting patiently for the 2.9 release.
19. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by mattlewis (admin) Oct 31, 2012
- 4141 views
Euphoria is NOT available yet available on ARM processors comfortably - and definitely not on ARM 7 version which is the current release of ARM processors. I have already pointed out that the current Raspberry Pi is not comfortable with the many popular releases of Linux because they all support ARM ver 7 and the Raspberry Pi is currently built with ARM6.
I'm not sure what you mean by "comfortably." Obviously, there has been no official release. I don't think that we rely on any ARM ASM (going by memory, I could be wrong, I haven't personally done anything with euphoria on ARM). I know there are alignment issues in places. Did this change with ARM7? Are there other issues?
It seems like the existence of a gcc toolchain for ARM7 is the biggest hurdle for euphoria.
Euphoria is definitely NOT available on Raspbian, the trusted version of Linux on Raspberry Pi - the one which would make the army of users of Raspberry Pi to start working with Euphoria.
You mean as part of the distribution itself? That's correct. Euphoria isn't in any distro's package manager, AFAIK.
Matt
20. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Oct 31, 2012
- 4133 views
I do not have a Pi. Nor will i consider buying one as long as i have unanswered questions about it, or need to find answers on non-english sites. After all, not even YOU can tell me about the 512K of ram YOU mentioned.
Please drop this thread of questioning. It was obviously a typo. He meant 512MB. I can't prove that you knew this, but can be annoyed by troll-like activity on a common sort of typo that's so easy to resolve (one post: snark, multiple posts: trolling).
Matt
I didn't know it was a typo. The 2nd edition of early Pi computers used a cots video chip that just happened to have a cpu in it (the 1st version used separate video and cpu chips), that core seemingly wasn't designed to have an OS running on it. I know some ARM chips made then and now are artificially restricted to 512Mbytes, i seem to recall early ARM were 512Kbytes. For an embedded low end video chip to be restricted to 512Kbytes wouldn't be unimaginable. As someone who has an army of C64, and a few VIC20, i saw the early ARM as the successor to the 6502 family, and the upgrade vector to the 6502/6510, but early on they were just as limited in memory size. I wanted to know, and EUWX said "512K", so i was asking him. But it's obvious from his posts since then that he hasn't a clue, and you are correct, and i appologise for going astray from proper etiquette.
useless
21. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Oct 31, 2012
- 4174 views
Please drop this thread of questioning. It was obviously a typo. He meant 512MB. I can't prove that you knew this, but can be annoyed by troll-like activity on a common sort of typo that's so easy to resolve (one post: snark, multiple posts: trolling).
The philosophy that I live by:
it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, t he olny iprmoatnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be in the rgh it pclae. The rset can be a taotl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit a porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe.
(from http://scienceavenger.blogspot.com/2007/12/cambridge-word-scramble-study-its-fake.html)
I didn't know it was a typo. The 2nd edition of early Pi computers used a cots video chip that just happened to have a cpu in it (the 1st version used separate video and cpu chips), that core seemingly wasn't designed to have an OS running on it. I know some ARM chips made then and now are artificially restricted to 512Mbytes, i seem to recall early ARM were 512Kbytes. For an embedded low end video chip to be restricted to 512Kbytes wouldn't be unimaginable. As someone who has an army of C64, and a few VIC20, i saw the early ARM as the successor to the 6502 family, and the upgrade vector to the 6502/6510, but early on they were just as limited in memory size. I wanted to know, and EUWX said "512K", so i was asking him. But it's obvious from his posts since then that he hasn't a clue, and you are correct, and i appologise for going astray from proper etiquette.
Still, I have to agree with Kat here. This was a typo that affected the meaning of the post, and when pressed for clarification, EUWX essentially dismissed it. (IF EUWX had said, "I meant 512m, not 512k" then I'd agree with you - but EUWX's very different response indicates something else to me.)
By the way, the Raspberry Pi are still in short supply.
I paid my deposit at the student bookstore and have been promised one in the next 2 weeks.
Also I forgot to mention that they now come with 512K memeory as standard.
How does tinybasic run on 512K of memory?
eukat
I am not too familiar with the product. You can try any of the above URLs. or try
http://www.golem.de/news/elternkompatibel-tinybasic-one-fuer-raspberry-pi-1210-95381.html According to them and I am quoting:
"Für den Raspberry Pi gibt es nun auch einen Basic-Interpreter. Tinybasic One soll mehr Leuten die Beschäftigung mit der für die Lehre und für Hobbyprojekte entwickelten Minicomputer-Platine ermöglichen - inklusive abschaltbarem Goto-Befehl."
You will probably understand that better.
This is not the first time that EUWX has been dismissive of EUWX's own typos: http://openeuphoria.org/forum/m/119388.wc
22. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by mattlewis (admin) Oct 31, 2012
- 4104 views
I didn't know it was a typo. The 2nd edition of early Pi computers used a cots video chip that just happened to have a cpu in it (the 1st version used separate video and cpu chips), that core seemingly wasn't designed to have an OS running on it. I know some ARM chips made then and now are artificially restricted to 512Mbytes, i seem to recall early ARM were 512Kbytes. For an embedded low end video chip to be restricted to 512Kbytes wouldn't be unimaginable. As someone who has an army of C64, and a few VIC20, i saw the early ARM as the successor to the 6502 family, and the upgrade vector to the 6502/6510, but early on they were just as limited in memory size. I wanted to know, and EUWX said "512K", so i was asking him. But it's obvious from his posts since then that he hasn't a clue, and you are correct, and i appologise for going astray from proper etiquette.
Still, I have to agree with Kat here. This was a typo that affected the meaning of the post, and when pressed for clarification, EUWX essentially dismissed it. (IF EUWX had said, "I meant 512m, not 512k" then I'd agree with you - but EUWX's very different response indicates something else to me.)
Fine...whatever...just don't act freaking helpless about some minor stupid thing like this is my point. 2 seconds to query google showed me that it was MB, and is a lot quicker than asking a simple question like this and waiting for a response. It makes the questioner look like a troll.
This is not the first time that EUWX has been dismissive of EUWX's own typos: http://openeuphoria.org/forum/m/119388.wc
Err...ok? Shouldn't we all be dismissive of typos? Why are we still talking about this?
Matt
23. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Oct 31, 2012
- 4131 views
Fine...whatever...just don't act freaking helpless about some minor stupid thing like this is my point. 2 seconds to query google showed me that it was MB, and is a lot quicker than asking a simple question like this and waiting for a response.
Agreed. Better to simply post a comment pointing out the typo (along with a source for the correct information), or to not post at all.
This is not the first time that EUWX has been dismissive of EUWX's own typos: http://openeuphoria.org/forum/m/119388.wc
Err...ok? Shouldn't we all be dismissive of typos? Why are we still talking about this?
We should all ignore typos as long as they don't impact the meaning of the message. My problem isn't that EUWX makes typos - it's the way EUWX would rather insult someone than own up to making a mistake. Assuming that these are mistakes on EUWX's part, rather than something more sinister.
It makes the questioner look like a troll.
24. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Oct 31, 2012
- 4142 views
Err...ok? Shouldn't we all be dismissive of typos? Why are we still talking about this?
Matt
Because he supplied different information, and i was wanting a [citation needed] answer. For a simple brain-dead embedded processor (environment control, washing machine, security system), 512K is fine, for a standalone computer with an OS, 512M may not be enough. But the same card could be offered with both configurations (or 3 or 4 configs), and EUWX could just as easily made his typo on card version designations instead of memory size.
useless
25. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by Jerome Oct 31, 2012
- 4093 views
Euphoria is NOT available yet available on ARM processors comfortably - and definitely not on ARM 7 version which is the current release of ARM processors. I have already pointed out that the current Raspberry Pi is not comfortable with the many popular releases of Linux because they all support ARM ver 7 and the Raspberry Pi is currently built with ARM6.
Just to add some more information, I've been using Euphoria on my Nokia N900 Linux device which uses an ARMv7 Cortex-A8 with lots of success. Also, I was lucky enough to get a Raspberry PI, and I've tried Euphoria on both the Arch and Raspbian distributions. I've built Euphoria both on the Raspberry Pi itself and on my Ubutu system using Scratchbox!
Thanks,
Ira
26. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Oct 31, 2012
- 4081 views
I have been on over 15 forums and am still on about 12. I write and reply as befits the questioner. If he or she is a useless member or useless questioner asking useless questions and the moderator does not intervene quickly, I reply to the useless member's useless question in a useless manner.
The forum etiquette is a lot different from writing technical articles and books. In a forum there is quick understanding of what is talked about, an understanding of the personality of person who is posting, and understanding of the quickly made answers. There is no room for ridicule in a well managed forum except in the context I just mentioned in the first para above.
For somebody (like me) who has experienced many forums and therefore, many different personalities and trolls, it is not very difficult to recognize and distinguish between the good, the mediocre and the bad and the trolls.
27. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by DerekParnell (admin) Oct 31, 2012
- 4103 views
I have been on over 15 forums and am still on about 12. I write and reply as befits the questioner. If he or she is a useless member or useless questioner asking useless questions and the moderator does not intervene quickly, I reply to the useless member's useless question in a useless manner.
The forum etiquette is a lot different from writing technical articles and books. In a forum there is quick understanding of what is talked about, an understanding of the personality of person who is posting, and understanding of the quickly made answers. There is no room for ridicule in a well managed forum except in the context I just mentioned in the first para above.
For somebody (like me) who has experienced many forums and therefore, many different personalities and trolls, it is not very difficult to recognize and distinguish between the good, the mediocre and the bad and the trolls.
This impresses me not one iota.
28. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 01, 2012
- 4077 views
I do not think I have ANY NEED to impress you in any fashion.
A lot of information has been posted by me regarding an area of potential benefit to Euphoria, which might conceivably affect you.
29. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by Lnettnay Nov 01, 2012
- 4137 views
You are just a little full of yourself aren't you?
30. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by DerekParnell (admin) Nov 01, 2012
- 4076 views
I do not think I have ANY NEED to impress you in any fashion.
Just as well then.
A lot of information has been posted by me regarding an area of potential benefit to Euphoria, which might conceivably affect you.
Thanks.
31. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Nov 01, 2012
- 4086 views
A lot of information has been posted by me regarding an area of potential benefit to Euphoria, which might conceivably affect you.
Thanks.
I think Jerome has given more concrete useable info regarding Euphoria on the Pi, and i look forwards to him doing a wiki page how-to. So thanks to Jerome for the real world "been there, done that" information.
useless
32. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by Jerome Nov 01, 2012
- 4010 views
... and i look forwards to him doing a wiki page how-to. So thanks to Jerome for the real world "been there, done that" information.
A wiki page sounds like a great idea! Is there anything in particular I should include? I would think cross-compiling could be the trickiest part so I'll make sure to include those steps.
Thanks,
Ira
33. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Nov 01, 2012
- 4009 views
... and i look forwards to him doing a wiki page how-to. So thanks to Jerome for the real world "been there, done that" information.
A wiki page sounds like a great idea! Is there anything in particular I should include? I would think cross-compiling could be the trickiest part so I'll make sure to include those steps.
Thanks,
Ira
It's a pretty sure bet no one else has a Pi, we'd all be newbies with it, so i think everything after "plug in the monitor, power, keybd, and mouse" might be useful. And compare running Euphoria on it to a desktop or laptop machine.
useless
34. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Nov 01, 2012
- 4000 views
Lonny's post on this thread was deleted. Why?
useless
35. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by Lnettnay Nov 01, 2012
- 4004 views
Somewhere around midnight or so I posted a message on this topic. http://openeuphoria.org/forum/m/119553.wc There seems to have been a response about 13 hours ago. http://openeuphoria.org/forum/m/119558.wc
(I did a search on the word 'full' and there were 2 posts containing that word in this thread.)
When I started looking at the forum about an hour ago neither message was there.
I checked my e-mail to see if there was anything from a mod/admin about why the messages might have been deleted. Nothing there. I acknowledge the fact that my post was sarcastic and added nothing to the discussion but I for one think it's extremely rude to arbitrarily delete a post without at least a warning. I chatted with Kat on IRC and she posted asking where my post was. It has since reappeared. The response still seems to be missing.
Anybody know what happened?
Lonny
36. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 01, 2012
- 3982 views
You are just a little full of yourself aren't you?
This is my response that got deleted. I can't remember the exact wording I used
I am more than a little full of myself, when I am dealing with half-baked helpers and developers like you.
I have to be full , when I am replying to people who spring up suddenly in a thread to bash for no reason.
You are way off topic.
37. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by DerekParnell (admin) Nov 01, 2012
- 3997 views
... The response still seems to be missing.
Anybody know what happened?
I do not know. I do remember seeing the post in the forum but it is certainly there now.
38. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 02, 2012
- 3969 views
You are just a little full of yourself aren't you?
My response to above was deleted twice. I do not see why this post has been reinstated. It is obviously a bashing post serving no other purpose than to discourage me from posting about special news.
This is my response. When I see a bashing post like this I think the person bashing is full of himself and nothing else. If you think you are good at creating a Euphoria version for the current Raspberry PI, go ahead. I doubt if you an even get started.
39. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Nov 02, 2012
- 3952 views
You are just a little full of yourself aren't you?
My response to above was deleted twice. I do not see why this post has been reinstated. It is obviously a bashing post serving no other purpose than to discourage me from posting about special news.
This is my response. When I see a bashing post like this I think the person bashing is full of himself and nothing else. If you think you are good at creating a Euphoria version for the current Raspberry PI, go ahead. I doubt if you an even get started.
I see both of your posts ranting at Lnettnay. Did you not see Jerome has Euphoria running on a Pi already?
useless
40. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Nov 02, 2012
- 3969 views
Somewhere around midnight or so I posted a message on this topic. http://openeuphoria.org/forum/m/119553.wc
When I started looking at the forum about an hour ago neither message was there.
I chatted with Kat on IRC and she posted asking where my post was.
It has since reappeared. The response still seems to be missing.
Anybody know what happened?
That was accidental. I apologize for the mistake. When I realized it was gone, I restored it. That use of humor to get another person to take a step back and rethink the tone of their posts (at least, that's how I interpreted it) should not have been taken down in the first place.
I checked my e-mail to see if there was anything from a mod/admin about why the messages might have been deleted. Nothing there. I acknowledge the fact that my post was sarcastic and added nothing to the discussion but I for one think it's extremely rude to arbitrarily delete a post without at least a warning.
I agree. This shouldn't happen except in the most extreme cases.
41. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by Lnettnay Nov 02, 2012
- 3954 views
Thank you. No harm, no foul. My post didn't seem to help matters any. 
Lonny
42. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by ne1uno Nov 02, 2012
- 4027 views
[] I chatted with Kat on IRC and she posted asking where my post was.
It has since reappeared. The response still seems to be missing.
That was accidental. I apologize for the mistake. When I realized it was gone, I restored it.
[] I for one think it's extremely rude to arbitrarily delete a post without at least a warning.
I agree. This shouldn't happen except in the most extreme cases.
that should never happen without at lease an EDIT:deleted by moderation...
added automatically. I have seen and been moderated. edits without the "EDIT:" or some such indication is unnerving and possible worse than the imagined offense.
all edits should be tagged with EDIT: and subjected to the recent file list as wiki pages are now.
43. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by Jerome Nov 08, 2012
- 3886 views
I found some time to start a Raspberry Pi wiki page: http://openeuphoria.org/wiki/view/EuphoriaAndRaspberryPi.wc. I didn't really add any getting started basics since the Raspberry Pi's own wiki has some great tutorials. Any feedback\suggestions would be appreciated as I start to write the second half!
Thanks,
Ira
45. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Nov 08, 2012
- 3825 views
Any information I gather, I will bring to this forum AS A REPORTER (not as a developer to be pounced upon by useless people) in the spirit of Open Source collaboration.
The problem with that is you don't report the facts. You have not yet explained your report of a new Pi release with 512K of ram.
useless
46. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 08, 2012
- 3873 views
I found some time to start a Raspberry Pi wiki page: http://openeuphoria.org/wiki/view/EuphoriaAndRaspberryPi.wc. I didn't really add any getting started basics since the Raspberry Pi's own wiki has some great tutorials. Any feedback\suggestions would be appreciated as I start to write the second half!
Thanks,
Ira
That is a good wiki. I am not sure what exactly you meant when you said:
"This tutorial is based on the Raspbian distribution, since it is currently the officially recommended distribution. Other options include Debian Wheezy,....."
2012-10-28-wheezy-raspbian.zip is the current official recommended distribution 10-11 days old.
I would suggest you also look at QTonPi project.
http://qt-project.org/wiki/Qt-RaspberryPi
Somebody on this forum has already done some work on QT on Euphoria, and you might leap straight into a nice GUI distribution of Euphoria (No offense meant to developers of wxEuphoria).
Another important aspect of Raspberry Pi and all ARM processors is the GPU which does boost the speed of Math related processing if you use the hardware. You might want to look at http://elinux.org/RPi_VideoCore_APIs in your work. Considering that the Pi uses a version 6 ARM, your work will probably transport easily to ARM7 processors, i.e. the current plethora of machines using Android OS.
I want to mention in passing that I have NO intention of usurping anybody's position here, be it useful or useless. I have a Pi on order and should be getting it next week. I will be going to the local Pi meetings. My main interest at the local level is my grandson, who I hope I will be able to take to these meetings. Any information I gather, I will bring to this forum AS A REPORTER (not as a developer to be pounced upon by useless people) in the spirit of Open Source collaboration.
47. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by ghaberek (admin) Nov 08, 2012
- 3849 views
Any information I gather, I will bring to this forum AS A REPORTER (not as a developer to be pounced upon by useless people) in the spirit of Open Source collaboration.
The problem with that is you don't report the facts. You have not yet explained your report of a new Pi release with 512K of ram.
FFS, it was a damned typo. Did you not see Matt's response?
Please drop this thread of questioning. It was obviously a typo. He meant 512MB. I can't prove that you knew this, but can be annoyed by troll-like activity on a common sort of typo that's so easy to resolve (one post: snark, multiple posts: trolling).
-Greg
48. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 08, 2012
- 3807 views
Any information I gather, I will bring to this forum AS A REPORTER (not as a developer to be pounced upon by useless people) in the spirit of Open Source collaboration.
The problem with that is you don't report the facts. You have not yet explained your report of a new Pi release with 512K of ram.
useless
You must be in a time warp.
To explain to ancient programmers I have to say that Raspberry Pi has 512 Kilo K or 512KK of memory.
I hope you understand it now
49. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by useless_ Nov 08, 2012
- 3836 views
Any information I gather, I will bring to this forum AS A REPORTER (not as a developer to be pounced upon by useless people) in the spirit of Open Source collaboration.
The problem with that is you don't report the facts. You have not yet explained your report of a new Pi release with 512K of ram.
FFS, it was a damned typo. Did you not see Matt's response?
Please drop this thread of questioning. It was obviously a typo. He meant 512MB. I can't prove that you knew this, but can be annoyed by troll-like activity on a common sort of typo that's so easy to resolve (one post: snark, multiple posts: trolling).
-Greg
Sorry Greg, but even now he stands by his original post, declaring i misunderstood his 512K as 512K when i should have understood it to be 512KK, and then blaming it on me being "ancient" because i should have understood the new way to say 512M is 512K. This is NOT him fixing his typo, it's an attempt to blame me for his inaccuracy:
You must be in a time warp.
To explain to ancient programmers I have to say that Raspberry Pi has 512 Kilo K or 512KK of memory.
I hope you understand it now
What i understand is you screwed up and you aren't "man enough" to admit it. This makes you a "reporter" of low veracity.
useless
50. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by mattlewis (admin) Nov 08, 2012
- 3811 views
This thread is nearing my tolerance for moderation, which is quite high. Please find something other than an old typo to talk about.
Matt
51. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 14, 2012
- 3718 views
announcement from Seneca college (I gave details about this effort a few weeks ago)
http://zenit.senecac.on.ca/wiki/index.php/Raspberry_Pi_Fedora_Remix_17
The Raspberry Pi Fedora Remix 17 is the second version of the Remix released.
Release date: (October 2012)
Fedora package collection version: 17
Architecture: armv5tel
Kernel version: 3.2.27-1
Final release is available here:
http://scotland.proximity.on.ca/raspberrypi/f17-releases/v5/latest/
52. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by BRyan Nov 15, 2012
- 3686 views
I am confused, why is this post being discussed on the euphoria forum ? How is it connected to euphoria programming ?
53. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 15, 2012
- 3774 views
I am confused, why is this post being discussed on the euphoria forum ? How is it connected to euphoria programming ?
Because there is at least one person who has enough interest to actually start working on Euphoria on Raspberry Pi.
http://openeuphoria.org/wiki/view/EuphoriaAndRaspberryPi.wc
If you care to read about this device, you will know that within 6 months of announcement over 500,000 units have been sold, and that they are expected to hit 1 million by Christmas.
http://www.trustedreviews.com/news/raspberry-pi-sales-to-top-1m-units-by-christmas
The person who has already ported some of the work is working with another version of Linux on Raspberry PI (Raspbian) and I am bringing to the notice of all Linux developers that Fedora (supported by Redhat) has a Raspberry Pi version or Linux working and they might like to look at it.
If you care to read about the ARM processor and the tremendous explosion of devices using the Android OS built around ARM processor, you would understand the trend away from x-86 and towards ARM processor. As long as Euphoria (or any other language) is being actively modified and new versions coming out, and if it is fairly easy to implement it on the latest popular ARM devices it is important that these developers look at the possible solutions.
54. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 15, 2012
- 3649 views
You might also google "arm vs x86" and get hit with over 100 discussions in the intelligent and progressive developer community. These discussions include the lowest level computers and the state-of-the-art SOC (system on a chip) including Servers in the cloud - competition.
55. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3657 views
I am confused, why is this post being discussed on the euphoria forum ? How is it connected to euphoria programming ?
Because there is at least one person who has enough interest to actually start working on Euphoria on Raspberry Pi.
Personally, I feel that the excellent work of that other person (Ira) is at best only tenuously connected to your posts. This latest one has no connection to Euphoria programming.
I am bringing to the notice of all Linux developers that Fedora (supported by Redhat) has a Raspberry Pi version or Linux working and they might like to look at it.
If the intented audience is the developers, then these posts are better off being sent to the dev list (as opposed to the users forum).
56. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 15, 2012
- 3694 views
Personally, I feel that the excellent work of that other person (Ira) is at best only tenuously connected to your posts. This latest one has no connection to Euphoria programming.
I am glad you used the word PERSONALLY above. I am also aware that your accolades to IRA are PERSONAL, but I share with you the appreciation of work done by IRA.
If you insist on antagonizing people, Euphoria will suffer, and you PERSONALLY will be extinguished by the clamour of other languages on Raspberry PI, such as "RUBY", "PYTHON", "BASIC", "JAVA", etc., etc.
BTW, have you heard of these languages?
I have no desire to extinguish you. In fact, I have made it clear that:
I am very aware of petty likes and jealousies and established people feeling threatened on small forums;
I am very aware of petty support for each other within the establishment on small forums;
I am a very experienced developer and programmer, but NOT very active, nor wanting to be active now, except in my own personal sphere of influence, viz. my interest in bringing up my grand children in the development world (don't worry, they will not be ready to displace you or anybody for another 8 years);
I do not wish to take anybody's place in Euphoria development or any other work associated with it;
At the same time, I have interest in Euphoria, because it is one of the few languages I have used, which has versatility, reliability, ease of use and usefulness in a low level language. Its minor weakness is lack of full development of a universally usable GUI and IDE, which I am aware are under constant scrutiny by Matt Lewis and ghaberek. I am 100% sure that these minor weakness will be rectified in the very near future.
So if you don't want to see Euphoria on a million or more $40 computers in the near future, keep on bugging and attacking me. It won't hurt me, but it WILL hurt you most.
57. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by euphoric (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3654 views
While I don't keep up with it myself, the Raspberry Pi hardware, and its possibilities for Euphoria, are very relevant in this forum, regardless of who initiates the discussion, or whether or not the word "Euphoria" makes it into the post.
IMHO.
P.S. What about the Ouya console? What news for us there?
58. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by DerekParnell (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3665 views
I am confused, why is this post being discussed on the euphoria forum ? How is it connected to euphoria programming ?
Because some people are interested in having Euphoria ported to the Pi platform. So posting this information here sounds perfectly reasonable to me.
59. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3655 views
I am also aware that your accolades to IRA are PERSONAL, but I share with you the appreciation of work done by IRA.
Glad to see it.
Personally, I feel that the excellent work of that other person (Ira) is at best only tenuously connected to your posts. This latest one has no connection to Euphoria programming.
I am glad you used the word PERSONALLY above.
I was trying to make clear that I was just speaking about my own thoughts, and not (for example) speaking out as a moderator, administrator, or a represenative of the dev team.
If you insist on antagonizing people, Euphoria will suffer, and you PERSONALLY will be extinguished
A word of caution here: I'm pretty sure you didn't mean it that way, but that comes very close to sounding like a death threat.
I have no desire to extinguish you.
Glad to hear it.
Anyways, I think you meant that if I go on "antagonizing people" then it'll turn other users away from Euphoria, which (since you seem to be assuming I don't do anything besides Euphoria stuff) makes me increasingly irrelevant, XFree86-style.
I feel sufficiently confident in my accomplishments, both inside and outside Euphoria, that I have no worries about myself in a personal sense. I also feel that this community, which has a long tradition of energetic debates, is unlikely to be affected (in terms of shrinking a lot, or growing significantly) by a relatively minor posting about Pi. So, overall, I'm not that worried.
Also, I contend that I am not antagonizing people.
In fact, I have made it clear that:
I am very aware of petty likes and jealousies and established people feeling threatened on small forums;
I am very aware of petty support for each other within the establishment on small forums;
I recommend then that you use your awareness to be more productive on this forum, instead of getting yourself into situations where you have to write a significant amount of text to defend yourself.
I am a very experienced developer and programmer, but NOT very active, nor wanting to be active now, except in my own personal sphere of influence, viz. my interest in bringing up my grand children in the development world (don't worry, they will not be ready to displace you or anybody for another 8 years);
I do not wish to take anybody's place in Euphoria development or any other work associated with it;
This impresses me not at all.
At the same time, I have interest in Euphoria, because it is one of the few languages I have used, which has versatility, reliability, ease of use and usefulness in a low level language. Its minor weakness is lack of full development of a universally usable GUI and IDE, which I am aware are under constant scrutiny by Matt Lewis and ghaberek. I am 100% sure that these minor weakness will be rectified in the very near future.
I disagree with you only in that I don't consider Euphoria a low level language (though it certainly interfaces well with several low level languages). I agree completely with the rest of what you said.
So if you don't want to see Euphoria on a million or more $40 computers in the near future, keep on bugging and attacking me. It won't hurt me, but it WILL hurt you most.
I guess I can have my cake and eat it too?
I'm very interested in seeing your plan on getting Euphoria on a million or more $0 computers. What are the steps you will take to accomplish this? What sort of timeline do you have? (Near feature is quite vague.) If applicable (I concede that it may not be), what kind of budget will this plan require?
60. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3680 views
I am confused, why is this post being discussed on the euphoria forum ? How is it connected to euphoria programming ?
Because some people are interested in having Euphoria ported to the Pi platform.
Well - I draw a dotted line between a post about porting (or using or supporting) Euphoria on the Pi platform, and a post about Pi in general.
It's sort of like, starting out with a post comparing Euphoria to Basic, and then moving on to some basic descriptions of Basic programming, then more specific HOWTOs of Basic programming, and then moving on to taking questions from users of Basic and giving answers and useful advice - all without mention of Euphoria.
So posting this information here sounds perfectly reasonable to me.
I agree. Certainly, this is more on topic than a thread about the USA elections.
61. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by DerekParnell (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3654 views
I agree. Certainly, this is more on topic than a thread about the USA elections.
That was meant to be humorous, no? But as it appears to be a 'dig' at me, I wish to say in my defense that the election topic was clearly marked from the outset as [OT] and secondly, this forum has limitations in its design that doesn't enable sectionalized topic areas, so discussions amongst the Euphoria community on topics other than the Language itself, must necessarily be interspersed with the other discussions.
62. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3638 views
I agree. Certainly, this is more on topic than a thread about the USA elections.
That was meant to be humorous, no?
Yes, it was. Sometimes I forget that humor and sarcasm don't translate as well on an electronic medium.
But as it appears to be a 'dig' at me, I wish to say in my defense that the election topic was clearly marked from the outset as [OT] and secondly, this forum has limitations in its design that doesn't enable sectionalized topic areas, so discussions amongst the Euphoria community on topics other than the Language itself, must necessarily be interspersed with the other discussions.
I agree completely with all of these points.
63. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by euphoric (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3643 views
[quote jimcbrown]
I agree. Certainly, this is more on topic than a thread about the USA elections.
That was meant to be humorous, no?
I LOLed. 
64. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 15, 2012
- 3645 views
I disagree with you only in that I don't consider Euphoria a low level language (though it certainly interfaces well with several low level languages). I agree completely with the rest of what you said.
I think I gave a wrong impression with the words "Euphoria a low level language".
What I meant was that compared with products like "Dreamweaver" or "SQL", Euphoria is "a low level language", meaning that it woks at the lower or fundamental level of CPU and access to the facility of CPU. Euphoria is good for application development and also for learning. The other 4GL languages are more application specific - in fact more like an application you might develop under Euphoria.
65. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 15, 2012
- 3652 views
I'm very interested in seeing your plan on getting Euphoria on a million or more $0 computers. What are the steps you will take to accomplish this? What sort of timeline do you have? (Near feature is quite vague.) If applicable (I concede that it may not be), what kind of budget will this plan require?
I gave you the industry expectation of 1 million Raspberry Pi sold by Christmas. I have tried before to impress upon you the extraordinary acceptance of the Education people of Raspberry Pi. The Profs and school teachers are ordering the Pi in 50s and 100s. I view the Raspberry PI as revolutionary as the announcement of Altair in, I think, 1974. It is ARM processor based and that processor is getting tremendous attention lately. Just as you could not do a lot with Altair,it is considered the start of the microcomputer revolution. The Pi is slightly different. It already has a millions of cousins (there is one in your pocket - your mobile phone) Your phone is not easy to start developing on, where as the PI is an ideal tool to develop on, and transfer the technology at a higher level to many of the tablets. A Euphoria implementation on the ARM processor can reach millions, and the applications developed under it can be sold as "APPs" by the enthusiastic kids of today. My big concern is that the processor used is version6 and most of the current devices are ARMV7 - but I was assured by a very senior teacher at Seneca College (where I attended a 2 day seminar) that the differences are not great and that probably the next version of the PI will be with ARM V7.
66. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by jimcbrown (admin) Nov 15, 2012
- 3632 views
I disagree with you only in that I don't consider Euphoria a low level language (though it certainly interfaces well with several low level languages). I agree completely with the rest of what you said.
I think I gave a wrong impression with the words "Euphoria a low level language".
What I meant was that compared with products like "Dreamweaver" or "SQL", Euphoria is "a low level language", meaning that it woks at the lower or fundamental level of CPU and access to the facility of CPU. Euphoria is good for application development and also for learning. The other 4GL languages are more application specific - in fact more like an application you might develop under Euphoria.
Ah, ok. In that case, I agree completely.
67. Re: Raspberry Pi revisited
- Posted by EUWX Nov 15, 2012
- 3608 views
Would you not like to see the word "Euphoria" in place of "Python" in the following letter at raspberrypi.org? I would
"Ross’ web server
There’s a reason that the Raspberry Pi was kept so affordable. Ross, 12, tells us how he built a web server–and other things–on a budget. And please do run that Raspberry Pi club Ross!
“A few months ago, around June, a friend of mine told me about a Raspberry Pi. During an IT lesson I looked at your website and loved the project. A few months later, the Pi arrived at my door.
The next problem was all the other parts. 2 days and all my pocket money later, just before I went on holiday, my Raspberry Pi was running (and this was without a keyboard – I used quemu to program it so it auto boots, then wrote quemu’s image file to the Pi).
Using my Pi, I have learnt a lot about python, Linux, and engineering. Whilst I was into programming before my Raspberry Pi (visual basic, HTML, java, action script etc) the raspberry pi really helped me learn python, which I use a lot now.
My school are waiting for theirs, and I may run a raspberry pi club in the future. My projects are: • A web server
• An HTML editor in python
• Programming your Raspberry Pi without needing to download anything, just point your browser to it. So far, the last project is going okay. I call it chocolate ice cream (a joke on all the sweet android names). It is programmed in flash. When it is nearer to being ready I will put it on my website.”
