1. non-update of RedyCode
- Posted by ryanj 3 days ago
- 116 views
I want to start by saying I absolutely love the concept and syntax of Euphoria. Once I realized how amazing and powerful sequences are, I was totally convinced that this was the language for me. It can be used to emulate any other programming paradigm (procedural, functional, object-oriented, etc.) and has so many ways to optimize performance one you understand how the interpreter works.
I've been using Euphoria for 20+ years. I put so much effort into making a Euphoria IDE (RedyCode), which uses a 100% pure Euphoria widget library, which only uses my own hand-built minimal C wrappers for win32 API to create windows, respond to events, and draw graphics to windows. So the entire widget library in "redylib" is written from scratch in pure Euphoria!
If you download RedyCode, you'll see it includes it's own source code as an example project 
so you can build/compile/run RedyCode from itself! Including the entire widget library and even the raw win32api wrappers.
To this day, I still use my 2019 version of RedyCode for all of my Euphoria projects (one major project I still use for my day-job), plus viewing or editing other types of files such as txt, bat, c, cpp, xml, json, ini, html, css, php, etc. https://www.redy-project.org/ despite the fact that RedyCode 1.0 has a few known bugs, quirks, and limitations (which I have learned to work around lol). I do use other text editors, of course, depending on what specific things I need to do. Use the right tool for the job, right (sometimes my RedyCode is a useful tool for certain text editing jobs.)
On one hand, I've very proud of the fact that I was able to write a pure-Euphoria editor with very specific features for Euphoria projects. But on the other hand, I feel like I've wasted so much time and energy investing in a dead-end programming language. Although I had so many ideas for RedyCode 2.0, I gave up on the whole project, because the language itself hasn't kept up with any of the modern requirements at all. I don't know what to do about it.
Sadly, I feel like Euphoria has been left in the dust compared to pretty much all other modern languages.
2. Re: non-update of RedyCode
- Posted by ChrisB (moderator) 3 days ago
- 113 views
Hi Ryan
You've not wasted your time, it's just that the user base isn't there to justify the effort we put in any more.
New programmers only see what's popular (specifically python / java / C / javascript etc etc), and for whatever reason Eu just hasn't caught on. Old seasoned programmers will only use languages with a large user base, updates and libraries ready to use. Game programmers have game languages, maths programmers have math languages, general purpose programmers have python / C / Visual basic. Eu is too generalised to fit anywhere any more.
Much like the VHS/Betamax showdown years ago.
I for one will continue to use Eu - I keep coming back to it after experimenting with others, it's just so much easier to use, but I think that it needs a thoroughly good makeover and repackaging. I have couched the subject before - IMHO is very much like a BASIC language, and could be 'sold' as a variant of that, but sadly I too feel that is a forlorn hope.
Pete has his great Phix language, but I feel that is mostly used by himself and a small subset of dedicate Eu devotees.
I won't 'leave' Eu, but the user base is dwindling and shrinking, such that it may well become a dead language.
To the devs (more knowledgeable than me), and you too Ryan, please keep developing Eu, it's libraries and core functionality. Even if others don't see it's beauty, I still do.
Cheers
Chris
3. Re: non-update of RedyCode
- Posted by Icy_Viking 3 days ago
- 106 views
Hi Ryan,
I agree with Chris, don't give up. I just skimmed through RedyCode and it looks pretty good. Also, having a GUI library written in Euphoria for Euphoria would be great. I think if the RedyLib GUI/Widget part could be made a little more user friendly, it'd be great for a Euphoria native GUI implentation. Also, Greg is working on Euphoria 4.2.0 which should help modernize Euphoria to an extent. I still am working as my wrappers as the libraries get updated, mostly SDL, SFML and Raylib. As for the DosLike wrapper, I ran into a snag, so that is on hold for now. I've tried a lot of different programming languages over the years, but Euphoria is still my favorite.
4. Re: non-update of RedyCode
- Posted by ryanj 2 days ago
- 87 views
- Last edited 1 day ago
Thanks for the encouragement, ChrisB. Actually, anytime I'm writing code in other languages (lately, PHP), I'm always comparing it to Euphoria in my mind. LOL
5. Re: non-update of RedyCode
- Posted by ryanj 2 days ago
- 94 views
Hi Ryan,
I agree with Chris, don't give up. I just skimmed through RedyCode and it looks pretty good. Also, having a GUI library written in Euphoria for Euphoria would be great. I think if the RedyLib GUI/Widget part could be made a little more user friendly, it'd be great for a Euphoria native GUI implentation. Also, Greg is working on Euphoria 4.2.0 which should help modernize Euphoria to an extent. I still am working as my wrappers as the libraries get updated, mostly SDL, SFML and Raylib. As for the DosLike wrapper, I ran into a snag, so that is on hold for now. I've tried a lot of different programming languages over the years, but Euphoria is still my favorite.
Thanks, Icy_Viking. I'm happy you actually looked at my source code. It was something that I worked so hard on many years ago when I was still learning. Back then, I was doing the best I could to emulate classes/objects with Euphoria sequences, and also using C wrappers.
I realize there are so many ways my redylib/RedyCode could be improved! There are some silly bugs and design flaws in my design that I would love to fix, but I just haven't had the time/energy to make the changes yet.
6. Re: non-update of RedyCode
- Posted by RobertS 1 day ago
- 63 views
I want to start by saying I absolutely love the concept and syntax of Euphoria. Once I realized how amazing and powerful sequences are, I was totally convinced that this was the language for me.
Absolutely the same with me. And I think that this amazing feature is hugely undersold.
I've been using Euphoria since the days of 2.x, was very happy with 3.1, then less happy with 4.0, didn't do much for many years, then ran into some issues that seemed (or actually were) unresolvable and almost made me quit, until I tried Phix, and ever since I'm happy again.
I don't know much if anything about the "pretty much all other modern languages," but for what I need, Phix is perfectly well suited. Dwindling user base poses a problem, of course, but I think that much of this is due to the way that Euphoria and Phix are presented. (In January in the thread "Archives" Pete said, "I'm always up for any (specific) ways to improve the web site, or docs, or Phix itself. Don't be shy now." I wasn't shy and made a few suggestions, but there was no response.)
Btw, in the two months of September and October my Phix-written calculator (hypatia-rpn.net) got 839 downloads, which proves that there is still some interest in text-based Windows console programs. The Phix source file got 21 downloads in these 2 months - not that much, but more than nothing, so some interest exists in this, too. I think more people might get interested in Euphoria and/or Phix, if they could find more actual examples of what this language can be used for, and see that for some tasks (and maybe for them) it may still be better suited than all the other and more modern languages ...
7. Re: non-update of RedyCode
- Posted by petelomax 21 hours ago
- 37 views
- Last edited 20 hours ago
A horrible thought occurred to me the other month that as the world embraces ChatGPT/CodePilot/etc, all my efforts to make programming easier fall by the wayside once AI is writing the code, all rather sobering and depressing. But within a week I realised it is quite possibly instead a wonderful opportunity: as programmers switch from writing code to "prompt engineers" and spend significantly more of their time reviewing the code that gets spat out at them, clarity and readability will become even more important. The abject terror of introducing bugs will probably become even more acute, and with luck ChatGPT will prove once and for all that absurd garbage such as the SOLID principles simply do not help at all. What will help is locating bugs quickly, and that is one thing I'm pretty confident Phix is pretty good at. Near-instant paste/run might help too. Nothing guaranteed in this funny old world, of course.
I wasn't shy and made a few suggestions, but there was no response.
I'm always up for any (specific) ways to improve the web site, or docs, or Phix itself. Don't be shy now.
Since you said not to be shy, a few thoughts on the Phix website ...
- The URL http://phix.x10.mx doesn't look very appealing and isn't that easy to remember.
- Even if technically it's irrelevant, the "Not Secure" note in the browser (http:// instead of https://) may scare people off.
- The Sponsor link shouldn't lead to a dead end for anyone who isn't on Github, it gives the impression that you only want to address the initiated.
- "Best viewed in 360p or better" (on the Tutorial page) looks like something from the last millennium.
- In the documentation, "Phix is now (since it is now around 38.5MB) distributed in five parts" looks like something from the last millennium, too.
- On the Download page, the paragraph that starts with "Lastly on Windows (only), pdemo.exw is automatically run ..." looks rather intimidating.
- The three entries in the Blog are from 2010, 2010 and 2021, giving the false impression that nothing has happened since 2021 and little in the 10 years before.
Regarding Phix itself, personally I'm really happy with it as it is (though I may feel a slight longing for a graphic IDE like the one that Judith Evans had been working on ...). I have only one humble request: when compiling a program with p -c myprog.exw, if there is an icon file myprog.ico in the same folder, would it be possible to automatically use it for the exe file?
Well, you said not to be shy ... :)
Robert
Ah yes, sorry, I read that, quietly agreed with most of it, worried about it a while, struggled to figure out anything actionable or even where to start, and let it fall through the cracks.
Regarding the icon, yes you can, though it may need to be in a very specific format. On line 1016 of pglobals.e is the definition constant default_rs_icon = {"ok.ico",{0,1}}.
You could edit that, or perhaps easier/safer you could backup/replace/restore that file. You may need to look inside ok.ico to figure out how to make your myprog.ico compatible with it.
In the docs, Core/Statements/Special/format directive contains some gumpf I wrote/tested a very long time ago that may or may not still work.
