1. Nate
A response longer than 1 line would be what he wants! Don't respond!
2. Re: Nate
I used to think Euphoria was a good language with great programmers. I
still do, but in reality you are ALL C coders.
- Nate
3. Re: Nate
>Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 08:34:44 -0400
>Reply-To: Euphoria Programming for MS-DOS
<EUPHORIA at LISTSERV.MUOHIO.EDU>
>From: Nate Brooman <nateb at LOG.ON.CA>
>Subject: Re: Nate
>To: EUPHORIA at LISTSERV.MUOHIO.EDU
>
>I used to think Euphoria was a good language with great programmers. I
>still do, but in reality you are ALL C coders.
>
>- Nate
>
>
... whoo, surprise, nate. Actually, more like VB, nate.
grr...
"LEVIATHAN"
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4. Nate
I just got off the phone with Nate's father.
He and Nate's mother were already aware of the situation
and I filled in some additional points that they weren't aware of.
David Brooman (father) had already received the e-mail I sent earlier
to him describing the situation and the damage that was done.
They seemed to be genuinely shocked, and upset about what has
happened. They have already contacted Nate's Internet Service
Provider to terminate his access to the Net. His father said
that Nate is just 12.
In my e-mail I warned Nate's father that if Nate or his friends
bothered me or anyone on this list again, in the slightest way,
I would immediately contact the Ontario (OPP) or Canadian
(RCMP) legal authorities, and turn over the evidence of what he did.
I don't plan to do anything further, but if the people
who were injured by Nate's program, or any legal authorities,
need any information from me, I'll provide it.
Regards,
Rob Craig
Rapid Deployment Software
http://members.aol.com/FilesEu/
5. Re: Nate
- Posted by Hawke <mdeland at NWINFO.NET>
Oct 06, 1998
-
Last edited Oct 07, 1998
Robert Craig wrote:
> I don't plan to do anything further,
i think i speak for nearly everyone (if not everyone, indeed)
when i say that not only have you done a considerable
amount (far and above what i think most expected) towards
resolving this, but I (we) would like to extend heartfelt
gratitude and appreciation for your help and your actions
in this quite bitter business.
on a purely personal note, i believe that you handled
the situation perfectly correctly. some have cried
for blood, vengence and legal action directly against
nate. the first two are quite inappropriate, obviously.
the last becomes a twisted dilemma.
nate being a minor means that his parents would be facing
legal issues, not nate. alternatively, if nate was
actually forced to stand in a court for this affair,
and found liable, he would goto juvenile detention.
taking nate away from his parents in that manner,
i do not believe to be the best solution. i'm speaking
as a father here. nate would not be given decent
guidance as to the error of his ways whilst surrounded
by others that are likely far more degenerate than he.
also, i don't believe that forcing nate's parents to
defend legal actions to be the answer either.
had nate's parents not done anything in response to
rob's informing them of their son's misdoings, then
i would say all bets are off, and don't bother grabbing
any boxing gloves.
so to those that feel that informing his parents
was 'lame', i would ask you to reconsider. although
it may seem that nate's parents have not done a 'good
job', i daresay they actually have.
question 1:
how many of you on this list, that are adults now,
never, *ever*, commited a wrong that got brought to your
parents?
question 2:
how many of you remember that fatefull ringing of your
doorbell, watched with ever growing eyes of fear as your
parent(s) held that ever so stoic "adult" talk with another
adult (likely another parent), watched in utter disbelief
as your parent(s) actually said "thank you for letting
me know that they did that, and don't worry, i'll have
a talk with them later", (god! they actually said
"thank you" for that), and began feeling your heart
beat through your chest as the door slowly closed
behind this bearer of news and your parent(s), now
alone with you, turned in that ever so deliberate,
ever so adult way, slowly around to face you.
interesting, it looks like more fall into the latter
category, than the former. is that a drop of sweat
forming on your forehead from rememberance?
if any of you still hold malice, due to your loss of
(yes i understand it could have been critical and
extremely monetarily valuable) data, try to be like
the kind elderly couple whose extremely valueable
plate glass window your baseball smashed.
i think there has been enough bad on this list,
lets focus on being kind, forgiving, and peacefull,
just like that elderly couple was the next day,
when they offered you a new baseball and fresh baked
cookies.
take care all, and care of, indeed.
you've all seen me say it a thousand times.
let's all try to live it now, ok?
it's easier to be peacefull than vengefull.
--Hawke'
6. Re: Nate
- Posted by lithex <lithex at INTERGATE.BC.CA>
Oct 06, 1998
-
Last edited Oct 07, 1998
Great post Hawke
IMHO
One lesson here for all of us is that flaming escalates and can be
really dangerous. Nate was being provocative, it's true, but many
people were also being self-indulgently provoked. There was an
escalation in the development of the "nate case" that might have been
nipped in the bud if we had just ignored his irrelevant postings.
So as well as being careful with code on the List, let's also try and
be tolerant.
Bye
Martin
7. Re: Nate
Hawke, reading your note, I could not believe my eyes! I felt, for the
second time today already, almost embarrassed, this time on your
behalf. For God's sake, it was you who originally threatened the
bastard with a legal action!
I must tell you about the first incident too. At lunch time I went to
a supermarket. The girl at counter made a mistake and gave me back
twenty dollars more than the bill indicated. I counted twice, spread
my hands and gave her twenty dollars back. Half-a-dozen people in the
queue behind me giggled. As I was leaving the store I heard the girl
giggling too. They all thought I was a moron. And I no longer felt
good about it, I was embarrassed, on their behalf.
My point is, if the coward is not punished, he will laugh at us, he
will taunt us again. Here we are not dealing with an accidentally
broken window by a baseball, we are dealing with a deliberate,
thought-out act of sabotage, and I do not really care about the age of
the bastard, my only regret is I am too far to reach for his throat.
jiri
8. Re: Nate
- Posted by Hawke <mdeland at NWINFO.NET>
Oct 06, 1998
-
Last edited Oct 07, 1998
BABOR, JIRI wrote:
>Hawke, reading your note, I could not believe my eyes! I felt,
>for the second time today already, almost embarrassed, this
>time on your behalf. For God's sake, it was you who originally >threatened the
>bastard with a legal action!
these following pastes are my reply to that:
Robert Craig Wrote:
>If anyone wants to take legal action against
>Nate (i.e. his parents), let me know.
I wrote:
>IMHO, at the very _least_, his parents should
>be informed. this might convince his parents
>to remove his net access from their end, thereby
>solving the above issue.
as you can see Jiri, you have no need to feel embarrased for
me as i am *not* the one that suggested legal action.
robert suggested legal action, I suggested that his parents
be informed and urged to repeal his net access.
Also, I do *not* threaten, I've outgrown it.
please, _everyone_, verify before uttering.
please!
>My point is, if the coward is not punished, he
>will laugh at us, he will taunt us again.
i daresay, he has been punished, by his parents, most
likely quite sternly. a punishment i would not like
to face, as when faced with a choice between watching
my parent(s) make that slow turn after closing the door
behind the bearer of my wrongdoing that i described in my
last message, versus juve'detention or jail, i'd
pick jail... i'm kinda sure a lotta yall would too :)
>Here we are not dealing with an accidentally
>broken window by a baseball, we are dealing with
>a deliberate, thought-out act of sabotage,
_sigh_... didn't you do anything that was 'wrong'
as a child/teenager that you "decided" or "thought
out" prior to doing it? premeditated in other words?
you never did anything wrong that was premeditated?
you didn't deliberately fire that rubber band from
that rubber band gun? that's an act, if done by an
adult that would be a far worse crime then what
nate did if it was done by an adult. think about it.
virii/trojan horse versus ASSAULT. you never pulled
a girl's ponytail? that would be bad bad bad as an adult.
so i say to all of you that never did *anything* wrong
and especially to those of you that never did *anything*
wrong that was not premeditated, tell me where eden is.
>and I do not really care about the age of the bastard,
>my only regret is I am too far to reach for his throat.
_sigh_
I dedicate this to you Jiri, with honor and respect:
there are those that live in hate,
they walk in the echo of spirit now dead,
their chance thrice ripped by fate,
everlong resounding eyes--quiet blood red.
Hawke' (Oct'98)
take care, and care of Jiri --Hawke'
9. Re: Nate
I did not run Nate's program so I can't speak
for those injured by it. I have lost files before, and I know
that it's one of life's most frustrating experiences.
I suggested legal action originally, and if someone wants
to persue it, that's up to them. At this time I do not intend
to do any more unless Nate or his buddies should happen
to resurface.
Having actually called David Brooman and talked with him,
I believe that he is very shocked, upset and remorseful about
what happened. He is also fearful of what will happen next.
I explained to him the likely extent of the damage that Nate caused.
As a chartered accountant, he understands
the economic implications of lost data. Like many parents,
he knows little about the Internet compared to his kid.
I called him because I wanted to make sure he had received my e-mail.
Had he been defiant, arrogant, unremorseful, etc. I would probably
be saying, yes, throw the book at him!
Call me an old softy, but I think Nate and his parents have learned
their lesson.
Regards,
Rob Craig
Rapid Deployment Software
http://members.aol.com/FilesEu/
10. Re: Nate
- Posted by jiri babor <jbabor at PARADISE.NET.NZ>
Oct 07, 1998
-
Last edited Oct 08, 1998
Hawke wrote:
>Also, I do *not* threaten, I've outgrown it.
>please, _everyone_, verify before uttering.
>please!
in response to my
>>For God's sake, it was you who originally
>>threatened the bastard with a legal action!
I said, quite clearly, 'originally'!
Let me quote from your 10 Sep 1998 message, you talked directly to
Nate:
>Your parents are your legal guardians, and as
>such, they are responsible for your actions. If anyone was
>to bring charges against you for this verbal abuse (the f' word)
>they would be the ones arrested, charged and made to stand trial.
>*Do* *you* *want* *that?*
(Sorry, *my* emphasis in the last line!)
If I were a cynic, I would say you have done quite a bit of growing up
in the last few weeks, in fact I would not hesitate to call it a
complete, beautiful metamorphosis. Or was it the desecration of the
American flag that got you going that time?
But that's not fair, and I should not say that, but I simply could not
resist it. And yes, I lost some data, but nothing tragic, and Rob is
right, Nate's parents are probably scared enough to deal with the
little snot.
And thanks for your little poem, Hawke, I shall treasure it. jiri
11. Re: Nate
- Posted by irv at ELLIJAY.COM
Oct 07, 1998
On Wed, 7 Oct 1998 17:48:46 +1200, BABOR, JIRI <J.Babor at GNS.CRI.NZ> wrote:
>I must tell you about the first incident too. At lunch time I went to
>a supermarket. The girl at counter made a mistake and gave me back
>twenty dollars more than the bill indicated. I counted twice, spread
>my hands and gave her twenty dollars back. Half-a-dozen people in the
>queue behind me giggled. As I was leaving the store I heard the girl
>giggling too. They all thought I was a moron. And I no longer felt
>good about it, I was embarrassed, on their behalf.
>
Strange. Since *she* would be the one having to come up with $20
when she closes the register, I wonder why she was giggling?
Two possibilities:
1. The employer makes up the shortfall - a really dumb idea, or
2. The clerk is too stoopid to think more than a minute ahead.
I vote (2) There is a severe oversupply of stoopid people right now.
12. Re: Nate
stoopid - Wrong spelling
stupid - Yup, that's Nate alright
_________________
When it comes to programming languages, Euphoria is a cut above
matt1278 at juno.com Euphoria programmer
Webbers: <A HREF="mailto:prezsoft at juno.com">prezsoft at juno.com</A>,
president of SoftCo. All virus proggers should die horrible deaths™
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13. Re: Nate
Maybe Nate is punished by his parents, maybe not. I don't want to take
legal action against him or his parents. I consider myself tolerant and
forgiving, but not if someone, no matter how old, *deliberately* uses
fascist language.
When he called Daniel an "untermensch", he must have been very aware of
what he was doing. Should we be tolerant about such behavior? Never!
Ad
14. Re: Nate
Ad Rienks wrote:
>When he called Daniel an "untermensch", he must have been very aware of
>what he was doing. Should we be tolerant about such behavior? Never!
You are absolutely right, Ad, never. It turned my stomach too. jiri
15. Re: Nate
- Posted by irv at ELLIJAY.COM
Oct 08, 1998
On Wed, 7 Oct 1998 10:06:09 -0400, Matt Z Nunyabidness <matt1278 at JUNO.COM>
wrote:
>stoopid - Wrong spelling
>stupid - Yup, that's Nate alright
>_________________
We're all stupid sometimes.
>Stoopid is when we make stupidity our goal in life.
>
>
>
>___________________________________________________________________
