1. How do you.....
In the Win32Lib, how do you get the font already on the window?
Thanks,
Philip
P.S. Win XP is worth the money.
2. Re: How do you.....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Philip D." <philip1987 at hotmail.com>
To: "EUforum" <EUforum at topica.com>
Subject: How do you.....
>
>
> In the Win32Lib, how do you get the font already on the window?
I'm unsure about what you are really asking for. Is it ...
The NAME or HANDLE of the font you are after? What about the font's other
attributes?
Are you interested in the font used when creating a window or the one being
used in any window or control already created?
In any case, when you create a Window, by default it uses the system font
ANSI_VAR_FONT which is usually mapped to MS-Serif at about 10 point. With
win32lib, you can choose an alternate font in one of two ways...
A call to setStartupFont(x) where 'x' can be one of ...
OEM_FIXED_FONT
ANSI_FIXED_FONT
ANSI_VAR_FONT
SYSTEM_FONT
DEVICE_DEFAULT_FONT
SYSTEM_FIXED_FONT
or a call to setCreateFont (which it seems I forgot to document - sorry).
This is a function used like this...
sequence oldValues
oldValues = setCreateFont("Times New Roman", 10, Normal, 0)
after which all controls created uses this font. Initially the font is "ms
sans serif", 8 point, Normal.
To find out the font assigned to a control use can use ...
sequence theFont
theFont = getControlInfo(id, CONTROLINFO_window_font)
This can be used with the element names FontName, FontSize, FontAttrib,
FontColor like this ...
theFont[FontName] -- faceName
theFont[FontSize] -- points
theFont[FontAttrib] -- Normal/Bold/Italic etc...
theFont[FontColor] -- Only applies to RichEdit.
--
Derek
3. Re: How do you.....
> P.S. Win XP is worth the money.
Money?
4. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by gertie at visionsix.com
Jun 01, 2003
On 1 Jun 2003, at 1:11, Greg Haberek wrote:
>
>
> > P.S. Win XP is worth the money.
>
> Money?
Well, good point, before the personal edition of XP was on the market in the
usa, the Malaysians were "selling" cracked versions of Corporate XP, which
doesn't phone home and doesn't need an activation from M$. But,,, if it ever
is online, eventually it will be tracked down, because all M$ OSs leak info
like a fish net. And are buggy enough to make them barely useable for a
serious computer user.
Kat
5. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by euman at bellsouth.net
Jun 01, 2003
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On 1 Jun 2003 at 0:20, gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
>
>
> On 1 Jun 2003, at 1:11, Greg Haberek wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > > P.S. Win XP is worth the money.
> >
> > Money?
>
> Well, good point, before the personal edition of XP was on the market in the
> usa, the Malaysians were "selling" cracked versions of Corporate XP, which
> doesn't phone home and doesn't need an activation from M$. But,,, if it ever
> is online, eventually it will be tracked down, because all M$ OSs leak info
> like a fish net. And are buggy enough to make them barely useable for a
> serious computer user.
>
> Kat
My WinXP has never Phoned home and I can still update the OS...
I have a version that came from an OEM which uses a product ID
that is identicle to other systems running the same OS.
(only different SID's but I also recommend downloading from Sysinternals
a utility to automate cganging your computors SID)
http://www.sysinternals.com/ntw2k/source/newsid.shtml
I think if I had a Phone home version I think I would also download the free
Sygate Firewall and stop the OS kernel from broadcasting...
just my .2 cents..
My WinXP hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very long time....
That is unless I run software that isnt compatible i.e, Win32lib apps
Euman
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<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">On 1 Jun 2003
at 0:20, gertie at visionsix.com
wrote:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> ============ The Euphoria Mailing
List ============ </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> On 1 Jun 2003, at 1:11, Greg
Haberek wrote:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > > P.S. Win XP is worth
the money.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > Money?</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> Well, good point, before the
personal edition of XP was on the market in the </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> usa, the Malaysians were
"selling" cracked versions of Corporate XP, which </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> doesn't phone home and doesn't
need an activation from M$. But,,, if it ever </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> is online, eventually it will be
tracked down, because all M$ OSs leak info </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> like a fish net. And are buggy
enough to make them barely useable for a </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> serious computer
user.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> Kat</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">My WinXP has
never Phoned home and I can still update
the OS...</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">I have a
version that came from an OEM which uses a
product ID</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">that is
identicle to other systems running the same
OS.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">(only
different</span></font><font face="Arial"><span
style="font-size:10pt"> SID's but I also recommend downloading
from Sysinternals</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt"> a utility to
automate cganging your computors SID)
</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">
</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span
style="font-size:10pt">http://www.sysinternals.com/ntw2k/source/newsid.shtml</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">I think if I
had a Phone home version I think I would
also download the free</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">Sygate
Firewall and stop the OS kernel from
broadcasting...</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">just my
.2 cents..</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">My WinXP
hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very long
time....</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">That is unless
I run software that isnt compatible
i.e, Win32lib apps</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span
style="font-size:10pt">Euman</span></font></div>
<div align="left"></div>
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6. Re: How do you.....
----- Original Message -----
From: <euman at bellsouth.net>
To: "EUforum" <EUforum at topica.com>
Subject: Re: How do you.....
[snip]
>
> My WinXP hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very long time....
> That is unless I run software that isnt compatible i.e, Win32lib apps
>
Proof is all I ask for, Wayne. Got any?
7. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by euman at bellsouth.net
Jun 01, 2003
--Alt-Boundary-24163.1773718
Content-description: Mail message body
On 2 Jun 2003 at 3:21, Derek Parnell wrote:
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <euman at bellsouth.net>
> To: "EUforum" <EUforum at topica.com>
> Subject: Re: How do you.....
>
>
> [snip]
> >
> > My WinXP hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very long time....
> > That is unless I run software that isnt compatible i.e, Win32lib apps
> >
>
> Proof is all I ask for, Wayne. Got any?
Do I really need to post the hundreds of messages saying people have problems
running Win32lib on XP??? How many changes have you made recently and how many
are pending??? Are you saying Win32lib is STABLE??? Didnt think so...
As for Windows versus Linux (to those who like downing Windows)
Linux is still unusable by the masses because the File structure is a freakin
nightmare.
All those OpenSource apps that came with my RHL8 are too scary to even
contemplate
running. Im a member of RH-Network and if you're not, you probably should be
because
there have been over 100 Alerts and patches to almost all the Internet and
Networking
utilities in the past 3-4 months. How many has MS produced in the past 3-4
months less
than 10. So you decide...
I think I'll finish that Dialog template project now so I can then finish my
installer.
Euman
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<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">On 2 Jun 2003
at 3:21, Derek Parnell wrote:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> ============ The Euphoria Mailing List ============
</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> ----- Original Message ----- </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> From: <euman at
bellsouth.net></span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> To: "EUforum" <EUforum at
topica.com></span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 1:14
AM</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> Subject: Re: How do you.....</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> [snip]</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > My WinXP hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very
long time....</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > That is unless I run software that isnt
compatible i.e, Win32lib apps</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> Proof is all I ask for, Wayne. Got
any?</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">Do I really
need to post the hundreds of messages saying people have
problems</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">running
Win32lib on XP??? How many changes have you made recently and how
many</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">are pending???
Are you saying Win32lib is STABLE??? Didnt think so...</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">As for Windows
versus Linux (to those who like downing Windows)</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">Linux is still
unusable by the masses because the File structure is a freakin
nightmare.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">All those
OpenSource apps that came with my RHL8 are too scary to even
contemplate</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">running. Im a
member of RH-Network and if you're not, you probably should be because
there have been over 100 Alerts and patches to almost all the Internet and
Networking
utilities in the past 3-4 months. How many has MS produced in the past 3-4
months less
than 10. So you decide...</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">I think I'll
finish that Dialog template project now so I can then finish my
installer.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span
style="font-size:10pt">Euman</span></font></div>
<div align="left"></div>
--Alt-Boundary-24163.1773718--
8. Re: How do you.....
----- Original Message -----
From: <euman at bellsouth.net>
To: "EUforum" <EUforum at topica.com>
Subject: Re: How do you.....
>
> On 2 Jun 2003 at 3:21, Derek Parnell wrote:
>
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <euman at bellsouth.net>
> > To: "EUforum" <EUforum at topica.com>
> > Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 1:14 AM
> > Subject: Re: How do you.....
> >
> >
> > [snip]
> > >
> > > My WinXP hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very long time....
> > > That is unless I run software that isnt compatible i.e, Win32lib apps
> > >
> >
> > Proof is all I ask for, Wayne. Got any?
>
> Do I really need to post the hundreds of messages saying people have
problems
> running Win32lib on XP???
Yes, please forward them on to me as I have not seen them yet.
>How many changes have you made recently
Dozens
>and how many are pending???
Hundreds
>Are you saying Win32lib is STABLE???
No. Never have either. In fact I've been saying the opposite. Notice that
its still not even up to version 1.0 yet! It has a LONG LONG way to go
before I'd use it in any commercial application.
And by the way, I hear that before Everest was first climbed, no one had
done that before.
"The longest march begins with a small step" - Mao Tze Tung
Are you saying that Win32lib is *more* unstable with XP than other windows
versions? If so, please show me something that I can use to recify that
situation. Holding back your evidence is not going to help anyone.
>Didnt think so...
And are you saying I should stop trying to get it stable? Didn't think so...
I hope you are not implying that the number of changes made to a product is
a sign of its stablity. If that was that case, all I'd have to do is stop
fixing things and it would be declared stable!
> As for Windows versus Linux (to those who like downing Windows)
What has this got to do with me and win32lib? Do you regard me in this group
too? If so, why?
> Linux is still unusable by the masses because the File structure is a
freakin nightmare.
> All those OpenSource apps that came with my RHL8 are too scary to even
contemplate
> running. Im a member of RH-Network and if you're not, you probably should
be because
> there have been over 100 Alerts and patches to almost all the Internet and
Networking
> utilities in the past 3-4 months. How many has MS produced in the past 3-4
months less
> than 10. So you decide...
And how many have MS not produced? There are many more documented issues
that MS could have fixed by now.
> I think I'll finish that Dialog template project now so I can then finish
my installer.
Great! I'm looking forward to using your Installer.
9. Re: How do you.....
On Sun, Jun 01, 2003 at 01:49:25PM -0400, euman at bellsouth.net wrote:
> As for Windows versus Linux (to those who like downing Windows)
> Linux is still unusable by the masses because the File structure is a freakin
> nightmare.
Only to those who don't bother to learn it. Its actually superior.
> All those OpenSource apps that came with my RHL8 are too scary to even
> contemplate
> running.
> Im a member of RH-Network and if you're not, you probably should be because
> there have been over 100 Alerts and patches to almost all the Internet and
> Networking
> utilities in the past 3-4 months.
Which is a good thing. Or would you rather they cover them up and not warn us?
Rapid bugfixes and alerts are a good thing, as they show extremely active
development and stability.
> How many has MS produced in the past 3-4 months less
> than 10.
And yet, there are HUNDREDS, if not THOUSANDS, of bugs that have not been fixed
by MS until after YEARS have past ...
Windows 9x has had more bugs than Linux/GNU, and yet fewer of those bugs have
been fixed!
> So you decide...
But be sure to check all your facts before making a decision.
>
> Euman
>
jbrown
--
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X HTML in e-mail and | Linux Machine:84163
/*\ news, and unneeded MIME |
10. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by euman at bellsouth.net
Jun 01, 2003
> > > [snip]
> > > >
> > > > My WinXP hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very long time....
> > > > That is unless I run software that isnt compatible i.e, Win32lib apps
> > > >
> > >
> > > Proof is all I ask for, Wayne. Got any?
> >
> > Do I really need to post the hundreds of messages saying people have
> problems
> > running Win32lib on XP???
>
> Yes, please forward them on to me as I have not seen them yet.
Maybe you should read the EuForum messages again
> >How many changes have you made recently
>
> Dozens
How many because someone said they ran XP?
> >and how many are pending???
>
> Hundreds
> >Are you saying Win32lib is STABLE???
>
> No. Never have either. In fact I've been saying the opposite. Notice that
> its still not even up to version 1.0 yet! It has a LONG LONG way to go
> before I'd use it in any commercial application.
Still too much overhead in Win32lib, look at Judiths IDE (although very nice)
its very slow even on my fast 2.53ghz machine.
> And by the way, I hear that before Everest was first climbed, no one had
> done that before.
>
> "The longest march begins with a small step" - Mao Tze Tung
Win32lib is Bloated so how is this a small step?
Code re-use is out the window.
> Are you saying that Win32lib is *more* unstable with XP than other windows
> versions?
> If so, please show me something that I can use to recify that
> situation. Holding back your evidence is not going to help anyone.
>
> >Didnt think so...
>
> And are you saying I should stop trying to get it stable? Didn't think so...
>
> I hope you are not implying that the number of changes made to a product is
> a sign of its stablity. If that was that case, all I'd have to do is stop
> fixing things and it would be declared stable!
>
> > As for Windows versus Linux (to those who like downing Windows)
>
> What has this got to do with me and win32lib? Do you regard me in this group
> too? If so, why?
Look between ( )
> > Linux is still unusable by the masses because the File structure is a
> freakin nightmare.
> > All those OpenSource apps that came with my RHL8 are too scary to even
> contemplate
> > running. Im a member of RH-Network and if you're not, you probably should
> be because
> > there have been over 100 Alerts and patches to almost all the Internet and
> Networking
> > utilities in the past 3-4 months. How many has MS produced in the past 3-4
> months less
> > than 10. So you decide...
>
> And how many have MS not produced? There are many more documented issues
> that MS could have fixed by now.
There are tons compared to pounds that use Windows
so it does make since that MS is a better OS especially XP+
> > I think I'll finish that Dialog template project now so I can then finish
> my installer.
>
> Great! I'm looking forward to using your Installer.
Hopefully not counting setbacks or ideas, soon.
11. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by gertie at visionsix.com
Jun 01, 2003
On 1 Jun 2003, at 15:50, euman at bellsouth.net wrote:
<snip>
> > > Linux is still unusable by the masses because the File structure is a
> > freakin nightmare.
> > > All those OpenSource apps that came with my RHL8 are too scary to even
> > contemplate
> > > running. Im a member of RH-Network and if you're not, you probably should
> > be because
> > > there have been over 100 Alerts and patches to almost all the Internet and
> > Networking
> > > utilities in the past 3-4 months. How many has MS produced in the past 3-4
> > months less
> > > than 10. So you decide...
> >
> > And how many have MS not produced? There are many more documented issues
> > that MS could have fixed by now.
>
> There are tons compared to pounds that use Windows
> so it does make since that MS is a better OS especially XP+
It's just that M$ doesn't bother to fix them, and the few that do get fixed are
done in one patch. Often the patches are worse than the original problem.
Add to that the backdoors and 10,000's of viruses and trojans released for
windoze, which M$ won't provide patches for. XP has it's own category of
virus hosting with the new Office stuff.
Kat
12. Re: How do you.....
Euman writes:
> My WinXP hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very long time....
The biggest "feature" of XP for me, is the fact
that it rarely crashes, especially compared to ME/98/95.
> That is unless I run software that isnt compatible i.e, Win32lib apps
Every Win32Lib-based app that has been posted on our site
in the past 12 months has been tested on my XP machine.
In general, I haven't noticed any problem with Win32Lib on XP.
In a couple of rare cases, someone may have assigned an
address to an integer, and on XP the address happened to be
bigger than 31-bits, so they had a type_check error.
But that was a problem in their code, not Win32Lib,
and I haven't even seen that very often.
I don't closely follow all the Win32Lib-related postings,
but it seems like most of the problems that are reported are
fairly minor, or fairly rare, and have nothing to do
with the O/S the person is using.
> How many changes have you made recently and how many
> are pending??? Are you saying Win32lib is STABLE???
> Didnt think so...
The only stable software is dead software.
As long as a program is actively used, there
will be demands for change.
Regards,
Rob Craig
Rapid Deployment Software
http://www.RapidEuphoria.com
13. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by gertie at visionsix.com
Jun 01, 2003
On 1 Jun 2003, at 16:34, Robert Craig wrote:
>
>
> Euman writes:
> > My WinXP hasn't crashed nor hickup'd in a very long time....
>
> The biggest "feature" of XP for me, is the fact
> that it rarely crashes, especially compared to ME/98/95.
Define "rarely"? What is the longest uptime before a crash? What's the
shortest?
Kat
14. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by euman at bellsouth.net
Jun 01, 2003
On 1 Jun 2003 at 15:32, gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
>
>
> On 1 Jun 2003, at 15:50, euman at bellsouth.net wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> > > > Linux is still unusable by the masses because the File structure is a
> > > freakin nightmare.
> > > > All those OpenSource apps that came with my RHL8 are too scary to even
> > > contemplate
> > > > running. Im a member of RH-Network and if you're not, you probably
> > > > should
> > > be because
> > > > there have been over 100 Alerts and patches to almost all the Internet
> > > > and
> > > Networking
> > > > utilities in the past 3-4 months. How many has MS produced in the past
> > > > 3-4
> > > months less
> > > > than 10. So you decide...
> > >
> > > And how many have MS not produced? There are many more documented issues
> > > that MS could have fixed by now.
> >
> > There are tons compared to pounds that use Windows
> > so it does make since that MS is a better OS especially XP+
>
> It's just that M$ doesn't bother to fix them, and the few that do get fixed
> are
> done in one patch. Often the patches are worse than the original problem.
> Add to that the backdoors and 10,000's of viruses and trojans released for
> windoze, which M$ won't provide patches for. XP has it's own category of
> virus hosting with the new Office stuff.
>
> Kat
You don't see this as probable propaganda perpetrated on the masses by
corporations who
have a stake in the other OS futures do you Kat?
Believe half of everything you see and nothing anyone says...
Im not saying WinXP is the most secure but everyone knows Linux is more
insecure.
( If over 100,000 script kiddies set out to wreck Linux it wouldn't have taken
but one. ) 
Euman
15. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by gertie at visionsix.com
Jun 01, 2003
On 1 Jun 2003, at 17:27, euman at bellsouth.net wrote:
>
>
> On 1 Jun 2003 at 15:32, gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
>
> >
> > On 1 Jun 2003, at 15:50, euman at bellsouth.net wrote:
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> > > > > Linux is still unusable by the masses because the File structure is a
> > > > freakin nightmare.
> > > > > All those OpenSource apps that came with my RHL8 are too scary to even
> > > > contemplate
> > > > > running. Im a member of RH-Network and if you're not, you probably
> > > > > should
> > > > be because
> > > > > there have been over 100 Alerts and patches to almost all the Internet
> > > > > and
> > > > Networking
> > > > > utilities in the past 3-4 months. How many has MS produced in the past
> > > > > 3-4
> > > > months less
> > > > > than 10. So you decide...
> > > >
> > > > And how many have MS not produced? There are many more documented issues
> > > > that MS could have fixed by now.
> > >
> > > There are tons compared to pounds that use Windows
> > > so it does make since that MS is a better OS especially XP+
> >
> > It's just that M$ doesn't bother to fix them, and the few that do get fixed
> > are done in one patch. Often the patches are worse than the original
> > problem.
> > Add to that the backdoors and 10,000's of viruses and trojans released for
> > windoze, which M$ won't provide patches for. XP has it's own category of
> > virus
> > hosting with the new Office stuff.
> >
> > Kat
>
> You don't see this as probable propaganda perpetrated on the masses by
> corporations who have a stake in the other OS futures do you Kat?
>
> Believe half of everything you see and nothing anyone says...
/me will defer to Travis, who M$ wiped out several times.
Kat
16. Re: How do you.....
gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
> Define "rarely"? What is the longest uptime before a crash? What's the
> shortest?
In 12 months of using XP every day, usually for several hours:
- I seem to recall only one actual XP "crash"
- I rebooted a couple of times because it was
acting a bit strange (some cosmetic problem developed
with the way some windows were shown).
- I rebooted a few times when trying to restore my Internet
connection, but I can't say that was XP's fault, the DSL
just seemed to go down for a while.
- It crashed twice during electrical storms, but that's hardly
XP's fault.
In contrast, my previous Win98, later WinME, machine crashed
an average of twice a day. It may have been partly due
to flaky hardware (though Linux on that same
machine rarely crashed - maybe an average of once per 200 hours).
Regards,
Rob Craig
Rapid Deployment Software
http://www.RapidEuphoria.com
17. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by xerox_irs at lvcm.com
Jun 01, 2003
I have used win32lib in a commercial app, it took forever(should have been
less than a week, to like six) to get all the bugs out, but when I did they
liked it and payed me.
Daniel Kluss
[snip]
> No. Never have either. In fact I've been saying the opposite. Notice that
> its still not even up to version 1.0 yet! It has a LONG LONG way to go
> before I'd use it in any commercial application.
>
> And by the way, I hear that before Everest was first climbed, no one had
> done that before.
>
[snip]
18. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by xerox_irs at lvcm.com
Jun 01, 2003
The best Linux game, "King if the Hill", its played over the network(or
internet), some hacker buddies get together, pick a common target(The Hill)
and try to get controll of it(King) and keep your buddies out, the Hill
usually has many kings thourghout the game, and they switch quickly, that is
until someone sees all the blinking lights(on the hub/router) and the logs
and maybe funny stuff on the screen, or try to log in, and they turn off the
*nix box(the hill). Very fun, I definitly recommend playing on your own
hardware though(chuckles).
Daniel Kluss
[snip]
> Im not saying WinXP is the most secure but everyone knows Linux is more
insecure.
> ( If over 100,000 script kiddies set out to wreck Linux it wouldn't have
taken but one. )
>
> Euman
19. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by gertie at visionsix.com
Jun 02, 2003
On 1 Jun 2003, at 18:06, Robert Craig wrote:
>
>
> gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
> > Define "rarely"? What is the longest uptime before a crash? What's the
> > shortest?
>
> In 12 months of using XP every day, usually for several hours:
"for several hours" ? So it's not left on 24-7 then, and given time to nuke
itself?
> - I seem to recall only one actual XP "crash"
> - I rebooted a couple of times because it was
> acting a bit strange (some cosmetic problem developed
> with the way some windows were shown).
> - I rebooted a few times when trying to restore my Internet
> connection, but I can't say that was XP's fault, the DSL
> just seemed to go down for a while.
> - It crashed twice during electrical storms, but that's hardly
> XP's fault.
>
> In contrast, my previous Win98, later WinME, machine crashed
> an average of twice a day. It may have been partly due
> to flaky hardware (though Linux on that same
> machine rarely crashed - maybe an average of once per 200 hours).
200 hours isn't much time either, only 8 days. I stay up 2 weeks before
rebooting just to save settings, but have gone 22 days, which is supposed to
be impossible on win95.
Kat
20. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by dm31 at uow.edu.au
Jun 02, 2003
On Sun, 1 Jun 2003 gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
>
>
> On 1 Jun 2003, at 18:06, Robert Craig wrote:
>
> >
> > gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
> > > Define "rarely"? What is the longest uptime before a crash? What's the
> > > shortest?
> >
> > In 12 months of using XP every day, usually for several hours:
>
> "for several hours" ? So it's not left on 24-7 then, and given time to nuke
> itself?
>
I assumed he meant that he actively used it for several hours a day, and
left it on when he wasn't using it(like I did).
> > - I seem to recall only one actual XP "crash"
> > - I rebooted a couple of times because it was
> > acting a bit strange (some cosmetic problem developed
> > with the way some windows were shown).
> > - I rebooted a few times when trying to restore my Internet
> > connection, but I can't say that was XP's fault, the DSL
> > just seemed to go down for a while.
> > - It crashed twice during electrical storms, but that's hardly
> > XP's fault.
> >
> > In contrast, my previous Win98, later WinME, machine crashed
> > an average of twice a day. It may have been partly due
> > to flaky hardware (though Linux on that same
> > machine rarely crashed - maybe an average of once per 200 hours).
>
> 200 hours isn't much time either, only 8 days. I stay up 2 weeks before
> rebooting just to save settings, but have gone 22 days, which is supposed to
> be impossible on win95.
When I was using win98se I left it up weeks at a time, only rebooting
normally when some code I wrote with euphoria/exotica, c++ or asm
crashed it.
Having said that, it seems very pointless arguing which OS appears
better then the rest... even more so with such a small group. When it
comes done to it, everyone will want something slightly different from a
OS, and every OS will preform slightly(or greatly) different on
different hardware. Not to mention that an OSes stability is also
greatly affected by what third party software is run on it, and how it
was setup. I've seen very stable 95, 98, 2K and XP boxes. In a gaming
clan I was in, there are 2K and XP boxes with uptimes normally around
3weeks +, and they normally are not rebooted due to crashes. My 98 box
was normally up for around 2 weeks at a time. I've also seen really
unstable ones which crash atleast once a day. The same can be said for
linux boxes I have seen.
Almost all OSes in common use MUST have good points about
them, otherwise they wouldn't be in common use, and every OS MUST have
bad points about them, otherwise there wouldn't be 'other' OSes. One of
the hardest things in todays world is not to get caught up in all the
propaganda floating around from all sides of a debate.
When it comes done to it, use an OS that YOU feel at home with, use one
that gets the job done that YOU require.
Cheers,
Dan
> Kat
>
>
>
> TOPICA - Start your own email discussion group. FREE!
>
>
21. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by kbochert at copper.net
Jun 02, 2003
--Alt-Boundary-4932.18163135
Content-description: Mail message body
On 1 Jun 2003 at 19:30, gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
>
>
> On 1 Jun 2003, at 18:06, Robert Craig wrote:
>
> >
> > gertie at visionsix.com wrote:
> > > Define "rarely"? What is the longest uptime before a crash? What's the
> > > shortest?
> >
> > In 12 months of using XP every day, usually for several hours:
>
> "for several hours" ? So it's not left on 24-7 then, and given time to nuke
> itself?
>
> > - I seem to recall only one actual XP "crash"
> > - I rebooted a couple of times because it was
> > acting a bit strange (some cosmetic problem developed
> > with the way some windows were shown).
> > - I rebooted a few times when trying to restore my Internet
> > connection, but I can't say that was XP's fault, the DSL
> > just seemed to go down for a while.
> > - It crashed twice during electrical storms, but that's hardly
> > XP's fault.
> >
> > In contrast, my previous Win98, later WinME, machine crashed
> > an average of twice a day. It may have been partly due
> > to flaky hardware (though Linux on that same
> > machine rarely crashed - maybe an average of once per 200 hours).
>
> 200 hours isn't much time either, only 8 days. I stay up 2 weeks before
> rebooting just to save settings, but have gone 22 days, which is supposed to
> be impossible on win95.
>
> Kat
>
Some interesting links:
http://216.239.57.100/search?q=cache:cxniQQrwbnIJ:www.eu.microsoft.com/france
/logicieloriginal/activation/docs/ManagingDownloadTechnologies.doc+xp+drm&hl=e
n&ie=UTF-8
whew! try Phone home to save some fingertips.
http://cryptome.org/ms-drm-os.htm DRM patent
http://www.infoworld.com/article/02/02/08/020211opfoster_1.html EULA
1) Office, Outlook etc produce DRM content by default (and later only)
2) Patents prevent Linux from implementing DRM.
3) New hardware will refuse to boot non-DRM OS's.
It will take a while, but Linux is doomed 
Fortunately I'm retiring soon, so its not my problem.
Karl Bochert
--Alt-Boundary-4932.18163135
Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Content-description: Mail message body
<?xml version="1.0" ?><html>
<head>
<title></title>
</head>
<body>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">On 1 Jun 2003
at 19:30, gertie at visionsix.com wrote:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> ============ The Euphoria Mailing List ============
</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> On 1 Jun 2003, at 18:06, Robert Craig
wrote:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > gertie at visionsix.com
wrote:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > > Define "rarely"? What is the
longest uptime before a crash? What's
the </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > > shortest?</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > In 12 months of using XP every day, usually for
several hours:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> "for several hours" ? So it's not left on
24-7 then, and given time to nuke </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> itself?</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > - I seem to recall only one actual XP
"crash"</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > - I rebooted a couple of times because it
was</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > acting a bit strange (some
cosmetic problem developed</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > with the way some windows were
shown).</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > - I rebooted a few times when trying to restore
my Internet</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > connection, but I can't say
that was XP's fault, the DSL</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > just seemed to go down for a
while.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > - It crashed twice during electrical storms, but
that's hardly</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > XP's
fault.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > In contrast, my previous Win98, later WinME,
machine crashed</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > an average of twice a day. It may have been
partly due</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > to flaky hardware (though Linux on that
same</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> > machine rarely crashed - maybe an average of
once per 200 hours).</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> 200 hours isn't much time either, only 8 days. I stay
up 2 weeks before </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> rebooting just to save settings, but have gone 22
days, which is supposed to </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> be impossible on win95.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> Kat</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#7f0000"><span
style="font-size:10pt">> </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">Some
interesting links:</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span
style="font-size:10pt">http://216.239.57.100/search?q=cache:cxniQQrwbnIJ:www.eu.microsoft.com/france/logicieloriginal/activation/docs/ManagingDownloadTechnologies.doc+xp+drm&hl=en&ie=UTF-8</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">whew!
try </span></font><a
href="http://216.239.57.100/search?q=cache:cxniQQrwbnIJ:www.eu.microsoft.com/france/logicieloriginal/activation/docs/ManagingDownloadTechnologies.doc+xp+drm&hl=en&ie=UTF-8"><u>Phone
home</u></a><font face="Arial" color="#0000ff">
<u> </u></font><font face="Arial">
to save some fingertips.</font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" color="#0000ff"><span
style="font-size:10pt"><u>http://cryptome.org/ms-drm-os.htm</u></span></font><font
face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">
DRM patent</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><a
href="http://www.infoworld.com/article/02/02/08/020211opfoster_1.html"><font
face="Arial"><span
style="font-size:10pt"><u>http://www.infoworld.com/article/02/02/08/020211opfoster_1.html</u></span></font></a><font
face="Arial">
EULA</font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><br/></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">1) Office,
Outlook etc produce DRM content by default (and later only)</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">2) Patents
prevent Linux from implementing DRM.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">3) New
hardware will refuse to boot non-DRM OS's.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">It will take a
while, but Linux is doomed </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">Fortunately
I'm retiring soon, so its not my problem.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br/>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10pt">Karl
Bochert</span></font></div>
<div align="left"></div>
--Alt-Boundary-4932.18163135--
22. Re: How do you.....
On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 00:35:04 -0300, <rforno at tutopia.com> wrote:
>
>
> Karl:
> What is DRM?
Digital Rights Management
--
cheers,
Derek Parnell
23. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by irvm at ellijay.com
Jun 02, 2003
On Monday 02 June 2003 01:46 am, you wrote:
>
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 00:35:04 -0300, <rforno at tutopia.com> wrote:
> > Karl:
> > What is DRM?
>
> Digital Rights Management
Which, in a nutshell, means that if someone else (Microsoft, or the RIAA, for
example) created it, you can't use it as you wish, even if you have paid fot
it.
But if _you_ want to create something, you will have to pay Microsoft for the
privilege, or what you have created won't run on DRM protected computers
[play on DRM cd's] ...etc. *
And they complain about the mafia.....
Irv
.
24. Re: How do you.....
On Mon, Jun 02, 2003 at 07:30:36AM -0400, irvm at ellijay.com wrote:
>
>
> On Monday 02 June 2003 01:46 am, you wrote:
> >
> > On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 00:35:04 -0300, <rforno at tutopia.com> wrote:
> > > Karl:
> > > What is DRM?
> >
> > Digital Rights Management
>
> Which, in a nutshell, means that if someone else (Microsoft, or the RIAA, for
> example) created it, you can't use it as you wish, even if you have paid fot
> it.
>
> But if _you_ want to create something, you will have to pay Microsoft for the
> privilege, or what you have created won't run on DRM protected computers
> [play on DRM cd's] ...etc. *
>
> And they complain about the mafia.....
>
> Irv
>
I wonder how they'll handle the running of non-DRM legacy Windows apps.
If DRM can't be turned off, then those old apps won't run, which will be a
huge incentive against DRM.
jbrown
--
/"\ ASCII ribbon | http://www.geocities.com/jbrown1050/
\ / campain against | Linux User:190064
X HTML in e-mail and | Linux Machine:84163
/*\ news, and unneeded MIME |
25. Re: How do you.....
>>
>>Karl:
>>What is DRM?
>
>Digital Rights Management
>
RMS likes to call it "Digital Restrictions Management" which I think is a
more fitting name.
Daryl Van Den Brink
26. Re: How do you.....
>
>>
>> On Monday 02 June 2003 01:46 am, you wrote:
>
>> >
>> > On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 00:35:04 -0300, <rforno at tutopia.com> wrote:
>
>> > > Karl:
>> > > What is DRM?
>
>> >
>> > Digital Rights Management
>
>>
>> Which, in a nutshell, means that if someone else (Microsoft, or the RIAA, for
>>
>> example) created it, you can't use it as you wish, even if you have paid fot
>> it.
>>
>> But if _you_ want to create something, you will have to pay Microsoft for the
>>
>> privilege, or what you have created won't run on DRM protected computers
>> [play on DRM cd's] ...etc. *
>>
>> And they complain about the mafia.....
>>
>> Irv
>>
>
> I wonder how they'll handle the running of non-DRM legacy Windows apps.
>
> If DRM can't be turned off, then those old apps won't run, which will be a
> huge incentive against DRM.
>
> jbrown
What if this was just a propaganda ploy to panic a lot of people into
buying non-DRM software before the iron curtain falls? It is just too
unlikely that M$ and others move to such a gaping break of
compatibility, given their record of maintaining ascendant compat with
obsolete techniques and products at a high cost.
That's why I don't fret too much about the issue. Just use third party
add-ons to protect your privacy. This is gettong harder since 911, but
remains possible.
CChris
27. Re: How do you.....
- Posted by gertie at visionsix.com
Jun 03, 2003
On 3 Jun 2003, at 11:04, Christian.CUVIER at agriculture.gouv.fr wrote:
>
>
> > Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 16:26:20 -0400 From: jbrown105 at speedymail.org
> > Subject:
> > Re: How do you..... On Mon, Jun 02, 2003 at 07:30:36AM -0400, irvm at
> > ellijay.com
> > wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> On Monday 02 June 2003 01:46 am, you wrote:
> >
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 00:35:04 -0300, <rforno at tutopia.com> wrote:
> >
> >> > > Karl:
> >> > > What is DRM?
> >
> >> >
> >> > Digital Rights Management
> >
> >>
> >> Which, in a nutshell, means that if someone else (Microsoft, or the RIAA,
> >> for
> >> example) created it, you can't use it as you wish, even if you have paid
> >> fot
> >> it.
> >>
> >> But if _you_ want to create something, you will have to pay Microsoft for
> >> the
> >> privilege, or what you have created won't run on DRM protected computers
> >> [play on DRM cd's] ...etc. *
> >>
> >> And they complain about the mafia.....
> >>
> >> Irv
> >>
> >
> > I wonder how they'll handle the running of non-DRM legacy Windows apps.
> >
> > If DRM can't be turned off, then those old apps won't run, which will be a
> > huge incentive against DRM.
> >
> > jbrown
>
> What if this was just a propaganda ploy to panic a lot of people into
> buying non-DRM software before the iron curtain falls? It is just too
> unlikely that M$ and others move to such a gaping break of
> compatibility, given their record of maintaining ascendant compat with
> obsolete techniques and products at a high cost.
> That's why I don't fret too much about the issue. Just use third party
> add-ons to protect your privacy. This is gettong harder since 911, but
> remains possible.
You haveto realise the usa gov is supporting these restrictions. By tagging
all communications' sources and destinations, they will be able to log all
internet communications more easily. The main holdup to IPv6 is the logging
ability and packet formating. All phone lines used for speech can be
wiretapped (it supposedly takes a court order, but those would be easy to
get now), and the digital lines will be tapped as a matter of course, without
court orders. Having a "3rd party" OS or socks driver simply means your
packets will be refused from internet routers with a error msg along the lines
of "if we can't read it, you can't use our internet". If an app passes DRM,
poeple will be more likely to use it, meaning signed snoopware will be used
without a 2nd thought. (All versions of Microsoft Office keep a number that
identifies your computer in each file you create that includes Visual Basic
macros. Office 97 keeps an identifying number even if there are no macros.) Look
how many people use javascript, java, activex, even tho i downloaded 5 public
examples of how to install malicious code remotely on someone's computer without
their knowledge, using any of them. If Adobe can get the us gov to use .pdf as a
default text editor, despite what other countries say about M$ and .pdf, you
know
M$, with it's money, will win. Howard Schmidt, vice chairman of the White
House's
National Critical Infrastructure Protection Board, was previously Microsoft's
chief
security officer. Scott Charney, Microsoft's current security officer, is a
former
federal official.
Kat
