RE: Eu's poor design(Irv)
Thanks for clarifying about the design flaw.
For me, I've found Euphoria has become my choice for making quick "hack" pr=
ograms to accomplish something specific. I've been using it a bit over a y=
ear now but just recently I've begun to get a lot more into it.
There are definite obstacles when using it to implement a large, commercial=
quality application. While not insurmountable as if you're resourceful you=
can always find a work-around, they're an issue.
Having to make sure your sequences are storing the type of data you want I'=
ve found as well can be a headache. You do need to check everything a user=
inputs carefully. I usually use an extra variable for that and make sure =
it's right before I add it to the sequence it's intended for. Of course, n=
ot only is that extra code but it doesn't address all of the possible probl=
ems as Irv pointed out.
Also, I'm not entirely sure it would be the ideal choice for a beginner unl=
ess an experienced teacher is involved. I'm able to fall back on my experi=
ence with other languages to figure things out when I need to. If I didn't=
have that experience to fall back on I would definitely want more document=
ation and reference material available than exists for Euphoria.
Still, all in all I really love Euphoria and I hope it continues evolving a=
nd becoming an even better product than it is currently. I also wanted to =
take a minute to thank all of the people involved with Win32Lib and IDE dev=
elopment. They're fantastic free contributions that have greatly enhanced =
the usefuless of the language for Windows development.
-Deric Wechter
eugtk at yahoo.com wrote:
>
>
>--- Al Getz <Xaxo at aol.com> wrote:
>=20
>> eugtk at yahoo.com wrote:
>> >=20
>> >=20
>> > 3. You totally missed the fact that Euphoria does
>> > indeed have a major design flaw. =A0One which causes
>> > problems both for beginners and for experienced Eu
>> > programmers, and which may limit Euphoria's future
>> > growth. =A0An analysis of this would make a good=20
>> > term paper.=20
>> >=20
>> > Irv
>> >=20
>> >=20
>> Hi Irv,
>>=20
>> What what might that be?
>
>Euphoria is a strongly-typed language which just can't
>
>seem to keep track of what those types are supposed to
>be, or how to use them.
>
>In most "high level" languages, after you define a
>variable=20
>as a certain type, you can just "print" that variable
>without concern about the type. Not with Eu. You,=20
>the programmer, have to choose the correct print
>function from a number of supplied functions
>to properly display each type of variable. This is a
>job=20
>for the computer language, not the programmer.=20
>For examples, see almost any language other than=20
>asm or C.=20
>
>In Eu, you can define a variable as an integer, and=20
>Eu won't let you assign a float to it. That's good.
>However, as soon as you try to create an array of 2 or
>more integers, all bets are off. =A0You can assign
>anything,=20
>including floats or strings, to those "integer" array
>positions. Are "arrays of integers" a useless concept?
>I don't think so.
>
>Speaking of arrays, it's pretty well accepted that=20
>arrays of characters (AKA "strings") are also useful=20
>in computer programming. So how do you tell Eu to
>create a variable that *must* be a string? Not one
>that could be a string, or might just as easily be an
>array of coordinates, or a list of pointers to C
>routines ?=20
>
>Structured data; believe it or not, a lot of=20
>programmers like to structure their data in some
>meaningful form. Let's say, for example, I want to
>keep=20
>track of my customers and how much they owe me.
>( just an example, no one would really want to do
>that,=20
>would they? )
>
>"Joe", 12.99
>"Sue", 4.50
>"Jack", 9.94
>
>Can you do this in Eu? Sure, except that if you
>actually=20
>try to keep the names and the amounts together as a=20
>package, you find that there's nothing stopping you,=20
>or an inept employee, from changing the data to :=20
>
>"Joe","applesauce"
>24, 4.50
>NULL, 9.94
>
>Sure, you can write routines to check each item as
>it's=20
>entered - but isn't that what a so-called "high-level"
>
>language is supposed to do for us?
>
>Even user-defined types don't help here, for at least
>two reasons:=20
>
>1. Your routine has to check _every_ single item in
>your=20
>"structure" whenever any _one_ item in that structure=20
>receives an assignment. In real life, this could mean=20
>dozens or hundreds of checks. Writing and debugging=20
>those routines is a chore, and everytime the structure
>
>changes even slightly, the UDT routines have to be
>re-written.=20
>
>2. What's worse, even after you have written that
>complex type-checking routine, once you detect an
<snip>
>
>
y!
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