Re: Challenge for speed freaks
- Posted by rforno at tutopia.com
Feb 16, 2002
Oopps... I meant "two years ago I taught a Java course"
----- Original Message -----
From: <rforno at tutopia.com>
To: "EUforum" <EUforum at topica.com>
Subject: Re: Challenge for speed freaks
>
> Just my two cents...
> I studied Java and two years I taught a Java course. But I cant call me a
> proficient Java programmer. Moreover, I hate Java.
> A year ago I started using Euphoria. I like using it. Two months from now
I
> expect to be teaching an Euphoria course at a local University.
> Problem is, in how much time one can proficiently program in a language?
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ray Smith" <smithr at ix.net.au>
> To: "EUforum" <EUforum at topica.com>
> Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 11:24 AM
> Subject: RE: Challenge for speed freaks
>
>
> > Irv Mullins wrote:
> >
> > > Why, if Euphoria is so much faster, are there hundreds or thousands of
> > > people
> > > who use perl, python, or java, etc. for every person who uses
Euphoria.
> >
> > Perl, Python and Java are free.
> > This is a huge factor!!!!
> > Everyone wants a free lunch. Even though the price of Euphoria
> > is inexpensive it's the concept behind it.
> >
> > Perl I have heard is very fast at text processing.
> > I'm sure there would be a large number of programs (text manipulation)
> > that would run faster in Perl. I haven't seen any action games in
> > Perl ... but that isn't the aim of the language.
> >
> > Python and Java have been built from the ground up as OOP languages.
> > Perl has been adapted to support OOP.
> > This is another huge factor.
> > As much as everyone on this list keeps saying they can live without
> > classes everyone else in the world says they can't.
> > Classes are a very powerful tool and I'd be very surprised if you
> > could name one "newly" developed NON OOP language that has been
> > successful in the last 10 years.
> > Do you think a couple of dozen people on a mailing list are going to
> > change the rest of the worlds mind re OOP?
> >
> > The 3 languages you mention are highly portable.
> > I know that Java and Python have threads support, exception handling,
> > many many more libraries available ... most freely downloadable.
> >
> > > Why do the bookshelves contain dozens of books on perl, python, and
> > > java,
> > > etc. but none for Euphoria?
> >
> > A simple question of user base.
> > It wasn't that long ago (2 years - probably 3!) that the first
> > Python book was released.
> >
> >
> > > Why do computer magazines run articles on these other languages, but
> > > make no mention of Euphoria?
> >
> > user base again.
> >
> >
> > > Could it be that *fast* just isn't the most important criteria for
most
> > > programmers?
> >
> > Three of the really big selling points for Euphoria are:
> > "fast",
> > "simple", and
> > "small".
> >
> > With the processing power of pc's these days is speed a real issue?
> > Except for specialized applications like action games, 3d modelling,
> > simulations etc speed is almost a non issue.
> > For these specialised cases you can still write sub routines in C.
> > Just like we do for Euphoria.
> >
> > Simple is a great thing to have. Simple doesn't have to mean you
> > don't have threads, or classes, or exception handling. It just means
> > when you do have these things they are implemented in a consistant
> > well structured way.
> > If they "are" implemented and people don't want to use them ...
> > then they don't!
> >
> > Small! - who copies files by floppy disk anymore?
> > All these other languages have 10mb or more downloads,
> > no one cares. It takes maybe an hour on a standard modem to download
> > them.
> > How much effort do people put into developing applications?
> > Is an extra hour to setup, and an extra 50MB of disk space going to
> > stop anyone from using Euphoria? I'd say no.
> >
> > > I don't buy the argument that marketing makes the difference, either -
> > > a lot of money has been spent to promote Java, but the rest? Not that
> > > I know of.
> >
> > How many of these popular languages are developed by one person?
> > It's impossible, can't be done.
> >
> > I don't mean this is an offense way Rob (if your reading!),
> > but what major software development project has become successful
> > by the authors just "seeing" what happens and not having any long
> > term plans or goals? That's Robs way, that's his choice and no one
> > can judge him and say he's wrong. What I can say is success won't
> > come knocking on your door!
> >
> >
> > For the PRO side:
> >
> > It's a bit harsh to look at some popular languages and say
> > "why isn't Euphoria like language X!"
> >
> > Java is a product developed by hundreds of people.
> > Python has commercial backing and has a number of full time staff
> > developing as well as a large band of eager users.
> >
> <snip>
>
> >
>
>
>
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