1. GIF Format
- Posted by Greg Phillips <i.shoot at REDNECKS.COM>
Aug 29, 1999
-
Last edited Aug 30, 1999
I just ran across this...it appears that if you operate a website that
uses gif images,or other LZW(TIFF-LZW, PostScript, Portable Document
Format (PDF), V.42bis, etc.) formats, you may have to purchase a $5000
license from Unisys, the people who patented the technology.
Also, if you write a program that reads or writes GIF images, you must
get a license. Lastly, if you download a program that makes use of GIF
technology, you must obtain a license from Unisys (which may or may not
cost money, depending on the circumstances). If you don't get this
license, you are supposedly in violation of
That, in a nutshell is what's wrong with the world today.
Take a look:
http://corp2.unisys.com/LeadStory/lzwfaq.html
Greg Phillips
2. Re: GIF Format
On Sunday, August 29, 1999 11:56 PM Greg Phillips wrote:
> I just ran across this...it appears that if you operate a website that
> uses gif images,or other LZW(TIFF-LZW, PostScript, Portable Document
> Format (PDF), V.42bis, etc.) formats, you may have to purchase a $5000
> license from Unisys, the people who patented the technology.
>
> Also, if you write a program that reads or writes GIF images, you must
> get a license. Lastly, if you download a program that makes use of GIF
> technology, you must obtain a license from Unisys (which may or may not
> cost money, depending on the circumstances). If you don't get this
> license, you are supposedly in violation of
>
> That, in a nutshell is what's wrong with the world today.
>
> Take a look:
> http://corp2.unisys.com/LeadStory/lzwfaq.html
> http://corp2.unisys.com/LeadStory/lzw-license.html
>
> Greg Phillips
That's why I've been considering writing a PNG library.
Lossless, supports more than 256 colors, and it's free...
( for more info see http://www.cdrom.com/pub/png/ )
Does anyone else have something started on this format?
There is open source C code provided but I'm not the most fluent with C...
-- Brian Broker
3. Re: GIF Format
"Brian K. Broker" wrote:
> On Sunday, August 29, 1999 11:56 PM Greg Phillips wrote:
>
> > I just ran across this...it appears that if you operate a website that
> > uses gif images,or other LZW(TIFF-LZW, PostScript, Portable Document
> > Format (PDF), V.42bis, etc.) formats, you may have to purchase a $5000
> > license from Unisys, the people who patented the technology.
> >
> > Also, if you write a program that reads or writes GIF images, you must
> > get a license. Lastly, if you download a program that makes use of GIF
> > technology, you must obtain a license from Unisys (which may or may not
> > cost money, depending on the circumstances). If you don't get this
> > license, you are supposedly in violation of
> >
> > That, in a nutshell is what's wrong with the world today.
> >
> > Take a look:
> > http://corp2.unisys.com/LeadStory/lzwfaq.html
> > http://corp2.unisys.com/LeadStory/lzw-license.html
> >
> > Greg Phillips
>
> That's why I've been considering writing a PNG library.
> Lossless, supports more than 256 colors, and it's free...
> ( for more info see http://www.cdrom.com/pub/png/ )
>
> Does anyone else have something started on this format?
> There is open source C code provided but I'm not the most fluent with C...
>
> -- Brian Broker
Actually, a little while ago I was thinking about doing a png viewer in
euphoria just for fun, but never got around to it. I still have all the specs
for the format lying around, if you want them, I'll email them to you.
Greg Phillips.
--
The Euphoria CD Project:
"Only $9.95, and comes with this juicer absolutely free!"
http://www.redrival.com/euphoria/doslinux.html
4. Re: GIF Format
On Monday, August 30, 1999 1:12 AM Greg Phillips wrote:
> Actually, a little while ago I was thinking about doing a png viewer in
> euphoria just for fun, but never got around to it. I still have all the
specs
> for the format lying around, if you want them, I'll email them to you.
>
> Greg Phillips.
>
Thanks... I've got no problem obtaining the specs.
I'd also like to add that I'd like to do this in Eu (no DLLs). If there is
interest, I'm more likely to concentrate my efforts towards the project...
you can send encouragement directly to bkb at cnw.com )
-- BKB
5. Re: GIF Format
On Mon, 30 Aug 1999, you wrote:
> I just ran across this...it appears that if you operate a website that
> uses gif images,or other LZW(TIFF-LZW, PostScript, Portable Document
> Format (PDF), V.42bis, etc.) formats, you may have to purchase a $5000
> license from Unisys, the people who patented the technology.
...
> That, in a nutshell is what's wrong with the world today.
This is also an excellent illustration of the total inability on the part of
management types to apply reason or logic to any problem.
Let's think for a moment: The obvious result of this "patent" enforcement will
be the immediate removal of all gif files from web sites, except for a handful
of very large sites for whom the cost of conversion would be > $5000.
Therefore, there will soon be no real demand for software which
uses the gif format. Hence, no reason for the software developers to
license the technology or include it in their products (browsers or editors)
Result: little income to the patent holders, and the eventual inability of
the few licensed users to find software which supports what is in essence
an orphaned format..
However, there will still be a significant _outflow_ of money from Unisys.
Let's "follow the money" -- Is anyone surprised to find that it will go to
the corporate lawyers?
This is obviously just another attempt by lawyers to extort money from
their clients and the general public. (see, for example, tobacco, guns, hot
coffee, .etc....)
Sell your Unisys stock - poor management decisions will kill any business,
sooner or later.
Irv Mullins
6. Re: GIF Format
Good analysis. I can't imagine any web developer paying $5k for a license,
when there are better formats for free. If UniSys was looking to trade
property rights with a few other big companies, that's one thing. But it
sounds like they are going after everybody, and this is something they can't
win, because the GIF technology is just not that important to anyone.
-- Brett
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Irv Mullins [SMTP:irv at ELLIJAY.COM]
> Sent: Monday, August 30, 1999 11:08 AM
> To: EUPHORIA at LISTSERV.MUOHIO.EDU
> Subject: Re: GIF Format
>
> On Mon, 30 Aug 1999, you wrote:
> > I just ran across this...it appears that if you operate a website that
> > uses gif images,or other LZW(TIFF-LZW, PostScript, Portable Document
> > Format (PDF), V.42bis, etc.) formats, you may have to purchase a $5000
> > license from Unisys, the people who patented the technology.
> ...
> > That, in a nutshell is what's wrong with the world today.
>
> This is also an excellent illustration of the total inability on the part
> of
> management types to apply reason or logic to any problem.
>
> Let's think for a moment: The obvious result of this "patent" enforcement
> will
> be the immediate removal of all gif files from web sites, except for a
> handful
> of very large sites for whom the cost of conversion would be > $5000.
>
> Therefore, there will soon be no real demand for software which
> uses the gif format. Hence, no reason for the software developers to
> license the technology or include it in their products (browsers or
> editors)
> Result: little income to the patent holders, and the eventual inability of
> the few licensed users to find software which supports what is in essence
> an orphaned format..
>
> However, there will still be a significant _outflow_ of money from Unisys.
> Let's "follow the money" -- Is anyone surprised to find that it will go to
> the corporate lawyers?
>
> This is obviously just another attempt by lawyers to extort money from
> their clients and the general public. (see, for example, tobacco, guns,
> hot
> coffee, .etc....)
>
> Sell your Unisys stock - poor management decisions will kill any business,
> sooner or later.
>
> Irv Mullins
7. Re: GIF Format
As far as I knew use of GIF format images is free.
So is using code to read GIFs.
It's only when you write code to WRITE a file in GIF format that you a required
to pay the
licence.
That is a program to read GI's is OK.
A program that writes GIFs must pay the $5000 licence.
This is why a lot of shareware paint program's wont save a GIF picture but will
read one.
-------------------------
Sincerely,
Mathew Hounsell
mat.hounsell at excite.com
8. Re: GIF Format
>That's why I've been considering writing a PNG library.
>Lossless, supports more than 256 colors, and it's free...
>( for more info see http://www.cdrom.com/pub/png/ )
>
>Does anyone else have something started on this format?
>There is open source C code provided but I'm not the most fluent with C.=
=2E.
I started writing a PNG reader a long time ago, but got bored and never
finished it. Anyway, I have already written a decompression routine for t=
he
compression algorithm used (it is the same as ZIP and GZIP; you can find =
it in
the Unzip program at my page), and started writing some other things too.=
If you need any help or if you want the stuff I've written (not much), ju=
st
tell me.
Regards,
Davi Figueiredo
davitf at usa.net
http://www.brasil.terravista.pt/Jenipabu/2571/
____________________________________________________________________
Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=3D1
9. Re: GIF Format
On Tue, 31 Aug 1999, you wrote:
> As far as I knew use of GIF format images is free.
> So is using code to read GIFs.
> It's only when you write code to WRITE a file in GIF format that you a
> required to pay the
> licence.
>
> That is a program to read GI's is OK.
> A program that writes GIFs must pay the $5000 licence.
>
Nope. and I quote from the Unisys web page (which probably requires a license,
too!):
License Information on GIF and Other LZW-based Technologies
More and more people are becoming aware that the reading and/or writing of GIF
images requires
a license to use Unisys patented Lempel Ziv Welch (LZW) data compression and
decompression technology, including United States Patent No. 4,558,302,
Japanese Patent Numbers 2,123,602 and 2,610,084, and patents in Canada, France,
Germany, Italy and the United Kingdom. Since January of 1995, Unisys has
entered into almost two thousand license agreements for use of GIF and other
LZW-based technology.
..........
Does this apply to just storing or serving GIF images on a web site?
Yes. See below:
Web Site LZW Licenses Available from Unisys
Because demand for LZW-related technology by Web developers continues to grow,
Unisys wants to make obtaining a license for Web-based use of the LZW
technology as easy and as straightforward as possible. Unisys therefore
announces a new way for operators of certain types of Web sites to obtain an
LZW license. If you are the operator of an Intranet Web site or an Internet
Billboard Web site (see detailed definitions) and use the types of images
covered by the LZW patent, you qualify. Types of images covered GIF,
TIFF-LZW, PDF-LZW images or other LZW graphical formats used in connection with
the creation, operation or maintenance of a Web site.
Now, reading further, you will find out that under certain conditions, a
not-for-profit BBS or web server with no commercial use or any items
for sale may use GIFs _IF_ the operator applies for a written waver from
Unisys. This waver may be provided at no charge, if Unisys so decides. Without
the written waver, or the $5000 license, _NO_ use is allowed.
The full text is here: http://corp2.unisys.com/LeadStory/lzwfaq.html
For lawyer-speak, it is pretty clear.
Regards,
Irv
10. Re: GIF Format
- Posted by Ralf Nieuwenhuijsen <nieuwen at XS4ALL.NL>
Aug 31, 1999
-
Last edited Sep 01, 1999
Unfortunately, according to a faq about compression I read some (long) time
ago .. (its was a standard faq of a compression techniques news group) there
are about 3 different pattents about LZW-based compression and they all
controdict. Unisys at least, is not the first. Lzh and any extended form of
run-lenght-encoding was already pattented by IBM a long long time ago. There
have never been no trail, but the word is, IBM would technically win such a
trail, since there pattent is older and the LZW technique is an applied form
of their pattened idea.
Like this more weird pattents exist and since I'm quite sure the website of
the juridical agencies aren't paying any loyalities, why would you ?
Ralf.
PS. Honestly, I wouldn't mind any hacker, kicking Unisys butt for these kind
of pranks though.
PPS. Btw, of all things a hacker could do on MS computers (eh. Hotmail)
opening everybody's email account is like the most stupid thing of all. It
hurts the audience, rather the corporate butchers.
> On Tue, 31 Aug 1999, you wrote:
> > As far as I knew use of GIF format images is free.
> > So is using code to read GIFs.
> > It's only when you write code to WRITE a file in GIF format that you a
required to pay the
> > licence.
> >
> > That is a program to read GI's is OK.
> > A program that writes GIFs must pay the $5000 licence.
> >
>
> Nope. and I quote from the Unisys web page (which probably requires a
license,
> too!):
>
> License Information on GIF and Other LZW-based Technologies
>
> More and more people are becoming aware that the reading and/or writing of
GIF images requires
> a license to use Unisys patented Lempel Ziv Welch (LZW) data compression
and
> decompression technology, including United States Patent No. 4,558,302,
> Japanese Patent Numbers 2,123,602 and 2,610,084, and patents in Canada,
France,
> Germany, Italy and the United Kingdom. Since January of 1995, Unisys has
> entered into almost two thousand license agreements for use of GIF and
other
> LZW-based technology.
> ..........
> Does this apply to just storing or serving GIF images on a web site?
> Yes. See below:
>
> Web Site LZW Licenses Available from Unisys
>
> Because demand for LZW-related technology by Web developers continues to
grow,
> Unisys wants to make obtaining a license for Web-based use of the LZW
> technology as easy and as straightforward as possible. Unisys therefore
> announces a new way for operators of certain types of Web sites to obtain
an
> LZW license. If you are the operator of an Intranet Web site or an
Internet
> Billboard Web site (see detailed definitions) and use the types of images
> covered by the LZW patent, you qualify. Types of images covered GIF,
> TIFF-LZW, PDF-LZW images or other LZW graphical formats used in connection
with
> the creation, operation or maintenance of a Web site.
>
> Now, reading further, you will find out that under certain conditions, a
> not-for-profit BBS or web server with no commercial use or any items
> for sale may use GIFs _IF_ the operator applies for a written waver from
> Unisys. This waver may be provided at no charge, if Unisys so decides.
Without
> the written waver, or the $5000 license, _NO_ use is allowed.
>
> The full text is here: http://corp2.unisys.com/LeadStory/lzwfaq.html
> For lawyer-speak, it is pretty clear.
>
> Regards,
> Irv
>
