1. to Rob (perhaps I'm a little bored, but...)
I've had this little notion of creating a program that scanned for string=
s.
If it found deltree, a major alarm would go off. Format, del, or erase?=
=
A minor alarm.
I bound a couple programs with system(deltree...). Is ASCII 203 the
internal code for system()? I don't see how I could use this, but its no=
t
interesting since I did a couple print() dumps of file sequences.
Is 203 used any other way?
--Alan
=
2. Re: to Rob (perhaps I'm a little bored, but...)
- Posted by Robert Craig <rds at EMAIL.MSN.COM>
Oct 08, 1998
-
Last edited Oct 09, 1998
Alan Tu writes:
> Is ASCII 203 the
> internal code for system()?
I believe so.
Don't ask for a table of these codes because:
a) I don't have one. Not even in the source code.
b) It helps security of shrouded programs somewhat if the codes
aren't published. Of course, now that we have scrambling,
I guess it doesn't matter much.
> I don't see how I could use this,
> but its not interesting since I did a couple print() dumps of file
> sequences. Is 203 used any other way?
You could also have ASCII code 203 inside a string.
Regards,
Rob Craig
Rapid Deployment Software
http://members.aol.com/FilesEu/
3. Re: to Rob (perhaps I'm a little bored, but...)
- Posted by Alan Tu <ATU5713 at COMPUSERVE.COM>
Oct 08, 1998
-
Last edited Oct 09, 1998
>Don't ask for a table of these codes because:
Don't worry. I won't. Thanks for the caution note on the string.
You know, Euphoria's PR could really use a little work-up. I am taking a=
programming class, and we are learning QuirkBasic. Oh I'm sorry, that wa=
s
QBasic, a typo. Next semester, we're learning Visual Basic. Actually, i=
ts
a spin-off course. Most still take QuirkBasic (oops, another typo) secon=
d
semester. When will Euphoria be taught in a school, or even in an
university? As far as biz, C++/C is totally dominant. I wanta see
Euphoria kick some C manuals out of cramped, airless, stuffy offices!
Alan
=
4. Re: to Rob (perhaps I'm a little bored, but...)
>You know, Euphoria's PR could really use a little work-up. I am taking a
>programming class, and we are learning QuirkBasic. Oh I'm sorry, that was
>QBasic, a typo. Next semester, we're learning Visual Basic. Actually, its
>a spin-off course. Most still take QuirkBasic (oops, another typo) second
>semester. When will Euphoria be taught in a school, or even in an
>university? As far as biz, C++/C is totally dominant. I wanta see
>Euphoria kick some C manuals out of cramped, airless, stuffy offices!
Well, it seems a few universicty classes all over the world have found
Euphoria.
But remember that for things like this, there is only type of PR. A Hype.
And if there is something Euphoria can never be.. (because it does not
contain any so-called brilliant completely new tricks.. its the subtlety of
the mix, in combination with performance... another thing that doesnt mean
much, the slower, the smarter and better it must be- ideology)
So, in other words, Euphoria might get more power, by evolution of itself
and its user group.
But to set a revolution in the world of IT is unlikely.
Euphoria makes all the choice lousy for companies:
Take for example the safety > performance .. "eh.. since when does this
apply on any software ?"
And, off course we now live in the world of Win32. If not in the world of
java classes, plugins, ActiveX'es and Virtual Machines. And precizely is
what areas is Euphoria missing ? Yes, we do have win32 support, we can call
DLL's .. but it seems its gonna be upto David Cuny to determine of the whole
Win32 platform has any point at all... it doesnt do much usefull on itself.
And things have to be *practicle* .. if you dont have a visual resource
manager with your win32 platform, its not considered to support win32.. and
I must agree to that.
Ralf
5. Re: to Rob (perhaps I'm a little bored, but...)
how come you guys don't like BASIC? What language do you think first
appeared on the IBM PC? Delphi?!?!
_________________
When it comes to programming languages, Euphoria is a cut above
matt1278 at juno.com Euphoria programmer
Webbers: <A HREF="mailto:prezsoft at juno.com">prezsoft at juno.com</A>,
president of SoftCo. All virus proggers should die horrible deaths™
___________________________________________________________________
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6. Re: to Rob (perhaps I'm a little bored, but...)
Ralf writes:
> Yes, we do have win32 support, we can call
> DLL's .. but it seems its gonna be up to David Cuny to determine
> of the whole Win32 platform has any point at all... it doesnt
> do much usefull on itself.
> And things have to be *practicle* .. if you dont have a visual
> resource manager with your win32 platform, its not considered to
> support win32.. and I must agree to that.
Certainly there's a lot we can do to improve the support for
the WIN32 platform, and I thank David for what he has done so far.
But I really think David has *already* accomplished something that
the fancy-pants all-singing all-dancing GUI IDE Visual
programming packages have failed at:
he's made it really simple for a non-professional
to write a simple Windows GUI program.
When I first sat down a couple of years ago to make
a very simple WIN32 program using Visual C++, I had
an unbelievably frustrating time trying to learn the system.
Sure, you can design your GUI elements visually on the screen.
That's great. But that's where the fun ends. For your trivial program
the system generates thousands of lines of incomprehensible
C++ code referencing all sorts of C++ classes that you know
nothing about. You are supposed to fit your code into their code
without really understanding how their code works. If you make
a mistake you get a machine exception - no explanation.
There are so many options, menus, buttons to push, help text to read
etc. that you get lost in it all. I had some assistance from another
programmer who had been through it before. That helped a lot,
but I never really got the hang of it, even after many full-days
of frustration. I eventually got my program to work, but I didn't
feel good about it, because I still didn't really understand it.
And don't forget, once you get the GUI working, you still have
to code/compile/link in C++ (1000 page manual)
- with the usual machine exceptions, malloc/free problems, copying
a string that's one byte too long, forgetting the 0-terminator etc.etc.
More recently, Junko tried to learn WATCOM's Visual C++
environment, which is somewhat simpler. She had pretty
much the same experience as me. I think if you use these
packages every day as part of your job, you will eventually
become competent with them. Casual users or hobbyists
should beware!
I've never actually programmed in Visual Basic but I did
skim through a manual several times (again, 1000 pages).
Ralf, don't you have Visual Basic? If it's so good, why
aren't you using it?
Regards,
Rob Craig
Rapid Deployment Software
http://members.aol.com/FilesEu/
7. Re: to Rob (perhaps I'm a little bored, but...)
- Posted by irv at ELLIJAY.COM
Oct 09, 1998
On Fri, 9 Oct 1998 09:00:46 -0400, Matt Z Nunyabidness <matt1278 at JUNO.COM>
wrote:
>how come you guys don't like BASIC?
We've used it.
>_________________
8. Re: to Rob (perhaps I'm a little bored, but...)
- Posted by irv at ELLIJAY.COM
Oct 09, 1998
On Fri, 9 Oct 1998 15:59:10 -0400, Robert Craig <rds at EMAIL.MSN.COM> wrote:
>Ralf writes:
>> Yes, we do have win32 support, we can call
>> DLL's .. but it seems its gonna be up to David Cuny to determine
>> of the whole Win32 platform has any point at all... it doesnt
>> do much usefull on itself.
>> And things have to be *practicle* .. if you dont have a visual
>> resource manager with your win32 platform, its not considered to
>> support win32.. and I must agree to that.
>
>Certainly there's a lot we can do to improve the support for
>the WIN32 platform, and I thank David for what he has done so far.
>But I really think David has *already* accomplished something that
>the fancy-pants all-singing all-dancing GUI IDE Visual
>programming packages have failed at:
>he's made it really simple for a non-professional
>to write a simple Windows GUI program.
>
>When I first sat down a couple of years ago to make
>a very simple WIN32 program using Visual C++, I had
>an unbelievably frustrating time trying to learn the system.
>Sure, you can design your GUI elements visually on the screen.
>That's great. But that's where the fun ends. For your trivial program
>the system generates thousands of lines of incomprehensible code...
Rob:
You need to try Delphi - very little actual coding is required, and
it's easy to understand. Visual Basic is ok, too, except not fast
enough to satisfy some clients' needs.
When I must write a Windows program, I can use either of these languages,
with the assurance that I won't get 50% or 75% or 90% finished, and
then run up against something that is "not yet implemented",
and have to scrap the project.
The thing is, I seldom _need_ a Windows program. Just about everything
is already available, usually as shareware, so it's really a waste of
time to reinvent the wheel.
And, I think most of us will agree, that having to deal with
Windows takes all the fun out of programming.
Regards,
Irv
>
