1. Benchmarks
Rob,
How up-to-date is this page: http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?
-=ck
"Programming in a state of Euphoria."
http://www.cklester.com/euphoria/
2. Re: Benchmarks
cklester wrote:
> Rob,
>
> How up-to-date is this page: <a
> href="http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?">http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?</a>
I ran it a couple of releases ago.
I didn't rerun it for 3.0.
The results can vary, depending on the
machine you use. Also, the interpreter sometimes
can get "out of tune" a bit, and need some minor adjustments
to make Watcom C generate the best possible code for the
common IL ops.
Regards,
Rob Craig
Rapid Deployment Software
http://www.RapidEuphoria.com
3. Re: Benchmarks
cklester wrote:
>
> Rob,
>
> How up-to-date is this page: <a
> href="http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?">http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?</a>
>
>
> -=ck
> "Programming in a state of Euphoria."
> <a
> href="http://www.cklester.com/euphoria/">http://www.cklester.com/euphoria/</a>
No, I don't think that it's up to date although it seems relatively current. I
plan on fixing this but I'm a slow procrastinator so give me time.
I plan on benchmarking Euphoria against Perl, Python, Ruby, Lua, Java, and of
course, C.
I'll publish eventually...
--
"Any programming problem can be solved by adding a level of indirection."
--anonymous
"Any performance problem can be solved by removing a level of indirection."
--M. Haertel
"Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
--C.A.R. Hoare
j.
4. Re: Benchmarks
Robert Craig wrote:
> cklester wrote:
> > How up-to-date is this page: <a
> > href="http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?">http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?</a>
> I ran it a couple of releases ago.
> I didn't rerun it for 3.0.
When will you be posting up-to-date results? :)
Jason Gade wrote:
>
> I plan on benchmarking Euphoria against Perl, Python, Ruby, Lua, Java,
> and of course, C.
>
> I'll publish eventually...
Cool! Does "eventually" mean "within the next few weeks?" 8)
-=ck
"Programming in a state of Euphoria."
http://www.cklester.com/euphoria/
5. Re: Benchmarks
cklester wrote:
> Jason Gade wrote:
> >
> > I plan on benchmarking Euphoria against Perl, Python, Ruby, Lua, Java,
> > and of course, C.
> >
> > I'll publish eventually...
>
> Cool! Does "eventually" mean "within the next few weeks?" 8)
>
> -=ck
> "Programming in a state of Euphoria."
> <a
> href="http://www.cklester.com/euphoria/">http://www.cklester.com/euphoria/</a>
The point is that I can't really promise any specific timeframe. I'm working on
it, but it may be a few weeks or it may be more.
Check out my shootout stuff in the archive
http://www.rapideuphoria.com/shootout.zip
As you can see, I've been working on it very itinerantly. However let's just say
that I hope to publish something by this spring.
--
"Any programming problem can be solved by adding a level of indirection."
--anonymous
"Any performance problem can be solved by removing a level of indirection."
--M. Haertel
"Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
--C.A.R. Hoare
j.
6. Re: Benchmarks
cklester wrote:
>
> Robert Craig wrote:
> > cklester wrote:
> > > How up-to-date is this page: <a
> > > href="http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?">http://www.rapideuphoria.com/bench.txt?</a>
> > I ran it a couple of releases ago.
> > I didn't rerun it for 3.0.
>
> When will you be posting up-to-date results? :)
>
> Jason Gade wrote:
> >
> > I plan on benchmarking Euphoria against Perl, Python, Ruby, Lua, Java,
> > and of course, C.
> >
> > I'll publish eventually...
>
> Cool! Does "eventually" mean "within the next few weeks?" 8)
>
I don't want to put words in his mouth, but _I_ took it to mean that "it'll
happen when it happens" ! Fair enough for a volunteer community, wouldn't you
say? I'm grateful that folks are stepping up to the plate in those areas that
interest them -- their precious time permitting, of course.
--
duke
SW of Calgary - near the Rockies
http://www.rootshell.be/~perlster/euphoria/
7. Benchmarks
-------Phoenix-Boundary-07081998-
In using the source code to develop modified
interpreters, I face two problems:
1) Does it handle Eu programs correctly?
2) Is it even close to the speed of Eu?
Can anyone suggest one or more benchmark
programs that would help answer these
questions?
Karl Bochert
-------Phoenix-Boundary-07081998---
8. Re: Benchmarks
5/03/2002 9:56:05 AM, kbochert at ix.netcom.com wrote:
>
>In using the source code to develop modified
>interpreters, I face two problems:
>1) Does it handle Eu programs correctly?
>2) Is it even close to the speed of Eu?
>
>Can anyone suggest one or more benchmark
>programs that would help answer these
>questions?
>
>Karl Bochert
>
>
>
>
I assumed you tried the DEMO\SANITY.EX and the programs in DEMO\BENCH that come
with Eu.
---------
Cheers,
Derek Parnell
9. Re: Benchmarks
On Mon, 4 Mar 2002 14:56:05 -0800, kbochert at ix.netcom.com wrote:
>
>In using the source code to develop modified
>interpreters, I face two problems:
>1) Does it handle Eu programs correctly?
>2) Is it even close to the speed of Eu?
>
>Can anyone suggest one or more benchmark
>programs that would help answer these
>questions?
>
Try Sanity.ex (I just found out it runs very differently after I
renamed it to sanity.exw). You may need to disable some of the
checksum tests. The benchmarks in C:/euphoria/demos/bench?
Also Judith's IDE if you are running windows.
Pete
10. Benchmarks
Just to allay the fears that all these enhancements are going to kill the
speed with which Euphoria programs run, would it be possible to publish some
benchmarks comparing version 2.5, 3.1, and 4.0?
11. Re: Benchmarks
Michael J. Sabal wrote:
>
> Just to allay the fears that all these enhancements are going to kill the
> speed with which Euphoria programs run, would it be possible to publish some
> benchmarks comparing version 2.5, 3.1, and 4.0?
Michael,
Would you be willing to create some valuable benchmarks (which is not an easy
thing to do) ? As far as new enhancements slowing things down, when you start to
use them, you will only see speed increases 
It's not a miracle, you can look
at the methods in parser.e and compiler.e....
However, some benchmarks would be nice, but I do not think for the fact of the
recent new enhancements. I also think, as anyone who has done benchmarking would
agree, that benchmarking is highly subjective and difficult to come up with some
that are useful.
That being said, I think for exposure, Euphoria should become part of The
Computer Language Shootout (http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/).
Jason Glade created some/all (?) of those benchmarks in the archive. Search for
benchmark. Would you be willing to make sure they still all run and run them in
different versions of Euphoria and post the results?
Now, those benchmarks will not show any speed improvements as I am sure none of
them are doing any conditional compiling that we would normally do in our
applications/libraries. So, we would probably need some benchmarks on top of
those.
--
Jeremy Cowgar
http://jeremy.cowgar.com
12. Re: Benchmarks
Yeah, you should use the ones that have been created so far:
http://www.rapideuphoria.com/shootout.zip
I kinda lost interest in continuing to develop it when they didn't want to
include Euphoria in the "official" shootout. But there are some pretty good tests
in there.
Not all of them written by me.
--
A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple
system that works.
--John Gall's 15th law of Systemantics.
"Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
--C.A.R. Hoare
j.
13. Re: Benchmarks
Jason Gade wrote:
>
> I kinda lost interest in continuing to develop it when they didn't want to
> include
> Euphoria in the "official" shootout. But there are some pretty good tests in
> there.
>
Jason, why did they not want to include it? In TIOBE index we are currently #47
in popularity and there are languages below that existing in the official
shootout.
--
Jeremy Cowgar
http://jeremy.cowgar.com
14. Re: Benchmarks
Jeremy Cowgar wrote:
>
> Jason Gade wrote:
> >
> > I kinda lost interest in continuing to develop it when they didn't want to
> > include
> > Euphoria in the "official" shootout. But there are some pretty good tests in
> > there.
> >
>
> Jason, why did they not want to include it? In TIOBE index we are currently
> #47 in popularity and there are languages below that existing in the official
> shootout.
>
> --
> Jeremy Cowgar
> <a href="http://jeremy.cowgar.com">http://jeremy.cowgar.com</a>
Maybe because I didn't sell it enough... I'd have to fish out the old emails
again.
The guy did email me back several months later and say that he was impressed
with the amount of tests that had been coded, and that they had some newer tests,
but he still wasn't interested in including Euphoria in the list.
--
A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple
system that works.
--John Gall's 15th law of Systemantics.
"Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
--C.A.R. Hoare
j.
15. Re: Benchmarks
Jason Gade wrote:
>
> Maybe because I didn't sell it enough... I'd have to fish out the old emails
> again.
>
> The guy did email me back several months later and say that he was impressed
> with the amount of tests that had been coded, and that they had some newer
> tests,
> but he still wasn't interested in including Euphoria in the list.
>
I think we should probably wait for Eu 4.0 to be released, (2nd generation of
open source Euphoria), update the tests, add new ones that are not implemented
and try again. We have to be able to interest him in it.
--
Jeremy Cowgar
http://jeremy.cowgar.com
16. Re: Benchmarks
Jason Gade wrote:
>
> The guy did email me back several months later and say that he was impressed
> with the amount of tests that had been coded, and that they had some newer
> tests,
> but he still wasn't interested in including Euphoria in the list.
So it was just some arbitrary decision by one guy? He wouldn't have to do
any work to include it, either, except maybe a link or two.
Wow. What an *censored*.
17. Re: Benchmarks
c.k.lester wrote:
>
> Jason Gade wrote:
> >
> > The guy did email me back several months later and say that he was impressed
> > with the amount of tests that had been coded, and that they had some newer
> > tests,
> > but he still wasn't interested in including Euphoria in the list.
>
> So it was just some arbitrary decision by one guy? He wouldn't have to do
> any work to include it, either, except maybe a link or two.
>
> Wow. What an *censored*.
I wouldn't say that, and I'm not sure if it was just one guy. I think there are
other people involved in the project. And I understand that they can't include
every niche language.
Having Euphoria easily installed on Linux will probably help a bit too.
--
A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple
system that works.
--John Gall's 15th law of Systemantics.
"Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
--C.A.R. Hoare
j.
18. Re: Benchmarks
c.k.lester wrote:
>
> Wow. What an *censored*.
I think you mean, "Wow. What a *censored*."
I swear, you kids and your awful Internet grammar.
Matt
19. Re: Benchmarks
Jason Gade wrote:
>
> Jeremy Cowgar wrote:
> >
> > Jason Gade wrote:
> > >
> > > I kinda lost interest in continuing to develop it when they didn't want to
> > > include
> > > Euphoria in the "official" shootout. But there are some pretty good tests
> > > in
> > > there.
> > >
> >
> > Jason, why did they not want to include it? In TIOBE index we are currently
> > #47 in popularity and there are languages below that existing in the
> > official
> > shootout.
> >
> > --
> > Jeremy Cowgar
> > <a href="http://jeremy.cowgar.com">http://jeremy.cowgar.com</a>
>
> Maybe because I didn't sell it enough... I'd have to fish out the old emails
> again.
>
> The guy did email me back several months later and say that he was impressed
> with the amount of tests that had been coded, and that they had some newer
> tests,
> but he still wasn't interested in including Euphoria in the list.
>
> --
> A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple
> system that works.
> --John Gall's 15th law of Systemantics.
>
> "Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
> --C.A.R. Hoare
>
> j.
Jason and Jeremy,
I found this in the forum archive:
<quote>
Date: 2007 Jan 8 18:40
From: Jason Gade <jaygade at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Computer Language Shootout
c.k.lester wrote:
>
> Which web site hosts this shootout? I've found several, but none have Euphoria
> included in the results.
I haven't actually submitted it yet, just to the Euphoria archive.
Shootout page: http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/
I need to find out if someone will make a Debian package or Gentoo ebuild for
Euphori
a 3.0. It's a requirement of the contest that the language be open-source and
have a
Debian package or Gentoo ebuild. Or be able to build from source in the standard
manner.
Alexander Torreson made a Debian package for 2.5 but that version of Euphoria is
not
open-source.
--
"Any programming problem can be solved by adding a level of indirection."
--anonymous
"Any performance problem can be solved by removing a level of indirection."
--M. Haertel
"Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
--C.A.R. Hoare
j.
</quote>
Things have moved on in the meantime, so trying again may not hurt.
CChris
20. Re: Benchmarks
CChris wrote:
>
> I need to find out if someone will make a Debian package or Gentoo ebuild for
> Euphori
> a 3.0. It's a requirement of the contest that the language be open-source and
> have a
> Debian package or Gentoo ebuild. Or be able to build from source in the
> standard manner.
>
I've built a few GenToo ebuilds, submitted and have been accepted into the main
GenToo dist. I am not a GenToo developer, so we would need to find a developer to
submit, but it didn't seem that hard last time I did it.
We would need to include the translated sources in a Unix source download. Then
it could be built on gentoo w/no previous Eu installed.
However, I think this should wait until 4.0 is released. If someone wants to
work on benchmarks, however, then they would be ready.
--
Jeremy Cowgar
http://jeremy.cowgar.com
21. Re: Benchmarks
One piece of advice that I was given by Isaac Gouy (of the shootout) was to
download their test framework from CVS and run the benchmarks and publish the
numbers myself.
I never got to that point.
--
A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple
system that works.
--John Gall's 15th law of Systemantics.
"Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
--C.A.R. Hoare
j.
22. Re: Benchmarks
> On 13 May 2008 at 7:21, Jason Gade wrote (maybe snipped):
> c.k.lester wrote:
> >
> > Jason Gade wrote:
> > >
> > > The guy did email me back several months later and say that he was
> > > impressed with the amount of tests that had been coded, and that
> > > they had some newer tests, but he still wasn't interested in
> > > including Euphoria in the list.
> >
> > So it was just some arbitrary decision by one guy? He wouldn't have
> > to do any work to include it, either, except maybe a link or two.
> >
> > Wow. What an *censored*.
>
> I wouldn't say that, and I'm not sure if it was just one guy. I think
> there are other people involved in the project. And I understand that
> they can't include every niche language.
>
> Having Euphoria easily installed on Linux will probably help a bit
> too.
>
I never understood why Rob didn't submit Euphoria to
http://dada.perl.it/shootout/ (the Win32 port of Doug Bagley
shootout). He mentions it at bench.doc but I wonder why no other code
but sieve.ex was created and submitted.
Euler
--
_
_| euler f german
_| sete lagoas, mg, brazil
_| efgerman{AT}gmail{DOT}com
23. Re: Benchmarks
I'd like very much to see Eu listed in the shootout, too.
For what concerns .deb distros, you could also prepare an .rpm release, and pass
it with alien to have both kind of installations (recorded by the Debian packages
database as "installed from alien"), but what about a good .configure/make/make
install chain ? That should allow people not willing to interfere with system
wide installation packages to choose a local install in $/home/xxx with ease.
Cheers.
MBianchi
Two cents, as always.
24. Re: Benchmarks
CChris wrote:
>
> I need to find out if someone will make a Debian package or Gentoo ebuild for
> Euphori a 3.0. It's a requirement of the contest that the language be
> open-source and have a Debian package or Gentoo ebuild. Or be able to
> build from source in the standard manner.
Yes, I've already made a debian package (for 3.2, when it was called that).
There's support for it in the source tree for both building a deb package,
and for making a standard source tarball.
Matt
