1. RE: Sunday's The Day
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As you might expect, I find plenty o' resources on the 'net to answer this
question...
I like that Mandrake offers to send me a PC already installed with their
distro! That will make things sweetly easy and convenient.
Debian looks to be a top-contender.
However, my purpose is to find one that runs EUPHORIA goodly-like because I
want to dev apps.
-ck
-----Original Message-----
From: C. K. Lester [mailto:cklester at yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 11:28 PM
To: EUforum
Subject: Sunday's The Day
I'm going to put a Linux distro on it... So... I know you hate me asking,
but...
Which Linux distribution should I get?!
:)
-ck
P.S. Let me rephrase... I'm FIRST going to choose a Linux distro, THEN I'm
going to buy the hardware for it... Compatibility's sake, ya know. ;)
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<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>As you=20
might expect, I find plenty o' resources on the 'net to answer this=20
question...</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>I like=20
that Mandrake offers to send me a PC already installed with their =
distro! That=20
will make things sweetly easy and convenient.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>Debian=20
looks to be a top-contender.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>However, my purpose is to find one that runs EUPHORIA =
goodly-like because=20
I want to dev apps.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>-ck</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D870454205-21122002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
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<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> C. K. Lester=20
[mailto:cklester at yahoo.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, December 20, 2002 =
11:28=20
PM<BR><B>To:</B> EUforum<BR><B>Subject:</B> Sunday's The=20
Day<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><PRE>=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The =
Euphoria Mailing List =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20
</PRE>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>Okay, I'm going to=20
go out and buy a new PC on Sunday, December 22, 2002, and I'm going to =
put a=20
Linux distro on it... So... I know you hate me asking,=20
but...</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>Which Linux=20
distribution should I get?!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>:)</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>-ck</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>P.S. =
Let me=20
rephrase... I'm FIRST going to choose a Linux distro, THEN I'm going =
to buy=20
the hardware for it... Compatibility's sake, ya know. =
;)</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D610322605-21122002><FONT face=3DArial=20
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size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV><PRE>=3D=3D^=3D=3D^=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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2. RE: Sunday's The Day
> >Which Linux distribution should I get?!
>
> If you really are going to let the kids play on it, like you
> said on IRC,
> I recommend you get an NVIDIA graphics card and then install NVIDIA's
> drivers. They're hardware-accelerated and are great even with my
> fairly old TNT2.
No, this first box will be daddy-only... I will whet their appetite for open
source OSes, however... heheh.
> As for distributions, I know a few people here use Mandrake.
I see that Mandrake is begging for money on their web site. Bad sign?
3. RE: Sunday's The Day
Good Luck with your computer purchase. One thing you
need to make sure you do is get a computer with (or
buy to add on) a hardware modem vis a vis a software
modem.
for nearly 10 years I've bought and built my computers
from these folks:
http://www.escstore.com/system_dept.asp?dept_id=SD-002
I think they offer a much better bang for the buck the
computers that I have seen pre configured with Linux
Distros. One advantage that the computers have that
come with Linux installed is that, if they have a
modem, it is definitly a hardware modem - well, at
least the ones sold by WalMart.
I've used Mandrake Linux for several years now - quite
satisfied.
Ken Rhodes
--- "C. K. Lester" <cklester at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> As you might expect, I find plenty o' resources on
> the 'net to answer this
> question...
>
> I like that Mandrake offers to send me a PC already
> installed with their
> distro! That will make things sweetly easy and
> convenient.
>
> Debian looks to be a top-contender.
>
> However, my purpose is to find one that runs
> EUPHORIA goodly-like because I
> want to dev apps.
>
> -ck
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: C. K. Lester [mailto:cklester at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 11:28 PM
> To: EUforum
> Subject: Sunday's The Day
>
>
> I'm going to put a Linux distro on it... So... I
> know you hate me asking,
> but...
>
> Which Linux distribution should I get?!
>
> :)
>
> -ck
>
> P.S. Let me rephrase... I'm FIRST going to choose
> a Linux distro, THEN I'm
> going to buy the hardware for it... Compatibility's
> sake, ya know. ;)
>
>
>
>
>
>
4. RE: Sunday's The Day
Hi ck,
C. K. Lester wrote:
> As you might expect, I find plenty o' resources on the 'net to answer
> this
> question...
>
> I like that Mandrake offers to send me a PC already installed with their
> distro! That will make things sweetly easy and convenient.
>
> Debian looks to be a top-contender.
I have been looking at Linux Distros for a couple of weeks and decided
on Mandrake. I haven't ordered it yet, but I will next week.
Since my bank balance is pretty ugly ... I bought 2 second hand PC's.
(PII 200MMX, 64MB, 3.2 GB HDD - base only for Aus $65 each! should
be ok for hacking around)
I'll load Mandrake on one and FreeBSD on the other.
Debian is considered the "most" open source (or pure) distribution as
it is developed 100% by a community of people and are a "not for profit"
organisation. I have heard it is very stable (ie. all packages are
well tested) ... but the install isn't as nice as some of the other
distros ... hence my decision to go mandrake).
> However, my purpose is to find one that runs EUPHORIA goodly-like
> because I
> want to dev apps.
I have run eu on redhat before (7.0 I think) so I assume Mandrake will
work without problems (since Mandrake is based on redhat).
Regards,
Ray Smith
http://rays-web.com
5. RE: Sunday's The Day
> I'll load Mandrake on one and FreeBSD on the other.
Why FreeBSD? Is that a *nix like Linux?
6. RE: Sunday's The Day
C. K. Lester wrote:
> > I'll load Mandrake on one and FreeBSD on the other.
>
> Why FreeBSD? Is that a *nix like Linux?
Well, Linux is the new comer, BSD Unix has been stable and used by
many thousdands of people before Linux was ever invented.
BSD Unix started at the university of California at Berkeley
(in the late 70's I think).
The current BSD Unix's (FreeBSD, NetBSD and OpenBSD) all are off shoots
of the original BSD Unix.
Some people describe Linux as a "Unix Like" OS, I don't really know
what that means???? There are many flavours of "Unix" and I would
have guessed that Linux is just one of these flavours.
Here's a link to a BSD Unix FAQ:
http://www.cs.uu.nl/wais/html/na-dir/386bsd-faq/part1.html
It's interesting to note that all the talk and media seem to be on Linux
even though the BSD *nix's seem just as (if not more?) mature than
Linux.
I'll know more in a few months when I do some more reading and load a
BSD Unix.
Regards,
Ray Smith
http://rays-web.com
7. RE: Sunday's The Day
C. K. Lester wrote:
> Which Linux distribution should I get?!
For general purpose use, just about any Linux distro will do. Mandrake
and RedHat are the most popular, so if you find yourself trying to fix a
problem, you've got a slightly better chance of finding someone 'in the
same boat' although in most cases I've found very little usable help
since most Linux users these days don't really know much about the nuts
and bolts. Those who do know a lot don't use the most popular distros.
> Debian looks to be a top-contender.
If stability is a top priority for you or you're a Free Software purist,
Debian is the way to go. It's also cheap. There's a guy in Manitoba who
will sell you the entire distro (8 CDs) for about $40 Canadian.
If you want to do video capture/editing, RedHat 7.2 or later is the
distro of choice at this juncture in time (Debian is working on
something in this area, but as far as I know it's still some distance
from being ready for primetime). Check the list of out-of-box supported
capture cards first, though.
But if you want the absolutely most stable OS _and_ simplicity of
configuration/maintenance, go with FreeBSD. One of the big advantages of
FreeBSD is that there is only one 'flavour.' That means that when you
read about how to do something in the FreeBSD handbook (which comes with
every install CD) you can apply that information to the distribution at
hand. With Linux, there are so many distributions and so much
information out there on the 'net that is applicable only to one or a
few distros, it's easy to get confused, especially if you're a
roll-up-the-sleeves kind of person or have a sticky problem to solve.
To answer another question I saw in this thread (forgive me for not
backtracking to that message so I can quote it):
Linux is referred to as "UNIX-like" because it didn't start from the
same code base as UNIX. Linus Torvalds, while still at university, wrote
the Linux kernel based on Minix, itself a UNIX-like OS used to teach OS
design. Minux was (if memory serves) written from scratch and so it too
is not a derivative of UNIX. Once the Linux kernel was developed, UNIX
tools were then ported, giving Linux a UNIX 'feel.'
As for the complete history of FreeBSD and how it came about, go to the
FreeBSD site (just add .org to freebsd) and read the introduction in the
handbook.
The bottom line for me was stability and security so I went with FreeBSD
for all the LAN servers I've ever set up. Stability was, of course, my
main concern. Once a FreeBSD server is configured and running, you
rarely have to do any maintenance. I set one up for a local non-profit
organization here in Bancroft a year and a half ago and they've only
called me once with a problem. The administrator had forgotten his
password (gives you an idea how often administration is necessary, eh?).
We also have to deal with sporadic power outages here in Bancroft and
with FreeBSD this isn't much of a problem. I've seen FreeBSD recover
from situations where Windows or Linux would choke, namely a power
outage while the OS was reading/writing to the hard drive. FreeBSD's
file system has a built-in redundancy that allows this. You might lose a
few log files, but nothing serious.
As for security, Linux has become plagued of late with WORMs and
virsuses (viri?). FreeBSD hasn't. And firewalling with Linux can be an
expensive on-going battle. With FreeBSD you use tunnelling which
by-passes firewalling altogether and makes your server pretty much
invisible while connected to the Internet.
And then there is also the Macintosh connection. FreeBSD was used as a
base for OSX. In effect, OSX is FreeBSD with the Mac GUI built on top.
For my money, that's the ultimate in stability and convenience of use.
The only drawback with OSX is that Euphoria isn't officially supported
(or even ported to my knowledge) yet.
> However, my purpose is to find one that runs EUPHORIA goodly-like
> because I want to dev apps.
Euphoria runs well on Mandrake 8.1 and FreeBSD 4.2 (these are the only
ones I have personal experience with so I'm not going to say anything
about the others). Installation is relatively straightforward on both;
just follow the README files. I'd also recommend EuGTK as a GUI
development tool.
I've been using Linux off and on since 1994 and FreeBSD solidly since
1996. If I had my druthers, I wouldn't have any Windows or Linux boxen
in my studio at all. Unfortunately, reality must be faced square on.
-Ron T.
8. RE: Sunday's The Day
Ron,
Thanks for the great report! What kind of hardware will support FreeBSD? Can
I, for instance, get the latest video/audio cards and expect they will work?
> And then there is also the Macintosh connection. FreeBSD was used as a
> base for OSX. In effect, OSX is FreeBSD with the Mac GUI built on top.
> For my money, that's the ultimate in stability and convenience of use.
> The only drawback with OSX is that Euphoria isn't officially supported
> (or even ported to my knowledge) yet.
If OSX is based on FreeBSD, does it really need a "port," since EU works in
FreeBSD already?
9. RE: Sunday's The Day
> Ron,
>
> Thanks for the great report! What kind of hardware will support
> FreeBSD? Can
> I, for instance, get the latest video/audio cards and expect they
> will work?
And conversely, if I want to go cheap, what's the minimum I should get?
10. RE: Sunday's The Day
> Well, you wont get a new IBM cheap...
i have always bought from a local generic builder (often right down the
street). that way, service is just down the street, as opposed to having to
ship the PC off for maintenance. plus, they all offer 3-year warranties...
i've never had a problem with a local vendor.
