1. In Re The Jok3r
Let it be noted that I am a supporter of the "free software"
community, whether you mean free/libre or free/gratis. However:
There is a community that operates largely under the same flag
whose interest points more toward vandalism and theft than toward
the open and voluntary exchange that "free software" is built on.
I do not support the activities of these criminals, and I have no
desire to associate with them. While it is difficult to
absolutely ascertain where a particular individual's sympathies
lie, it is _generally_ the case that when one adopts the
mannerisms and operates from or in the locations of a group, one
will be perceived as acquiring any taint that group may bear. So
it is in the case of "The Jok3r". I have, as yet, seen nothing
to dissuade me from the conclusion that this individual is in no
way different from any of the other vandals and thieves that have
adopted many of the same mannerisms - the dissemination of
information designed to deprive software authors of their income;
the use of "cool" spellings, often substituting numbers for
letters, in obvious aliases; the association with others who do
such things; the requests for information (as contrasted with
pointers to information) that is easily available in books on
operating system APIs, or whose use in a program is /prima facie/
questionable; and so on.
Regardless of such a person's perhaps legitimate interest in
Euphoria - or any other language - the fact that such a request
was their _first_ post to this list, suggests to me that this
person's interests are less than innocent, and I consider such a
person unwelcome. We have had people on this list before who
were young and immature and did not understand the full
ramifications of their activities, but were nevertheless good
citizens on this list after having their errors explained to
them; we have also had people who have posted malicious programs
to this list. Once burned, twice shy, however, and having seen
the results of the burning of others (though never having
actually been burned myself), I consider myself to be in roughly
the position of a police officer who has had three partners shot
from under him, though never having been shot himself - I am
_very_ skittish when the M.O. and description match up too well.
Jok3r, for all I know, you may be Richard Stallman, Mitch Kapor,
or Bill Gates, and may post responsibly under any of those names;
however, until you show evidence of being a responsible net
citizen, I will not welcome you here, or anywhere that I
participate. It is people like you appear to be that spoil the
network for the rest of us, and induce paranoia as a result of
sensational press exposure in the non-cognoscenti; this is a
disservice to the net equivalent in my view to the cardinal -
perhaps even mortal - sins of Christian theology. I am not alone
in this, though I may be one of very few who will speak out on
the topic. Go now from this place, and sin no more, and when you
have reformed, come back and be welcomed.
--
Jeff Zeitlin
jzeitlin at cyburban.com
2. Re: In Re The Jok3r
Rett,
Whether I agree with him or not...
I don't beleive that flames are meant for this list. Much more can be said
with silence sometimes, than getting everyone all excited about something
you don't actually have any information about...
As to the quantity of information you post...I have the right and
ability to delete it, and when I find that it is run-on, I do. I do see
some interesting things, and and appreciate that sometimes you bring things
to light that need to be said, and point out things that need it as well.
I don't know jokr, and deal with virus's and the effects of their kin
on a regular basis, doing ISP tech support. I wish they weren't there, but
they are, and computer security is getting better as a result of their
attacks. We need that security, especially in the home pc area.
I am not saying also, David, that you agree with him because you are
silent, but also there are probably a few out there that do... I just think
if you don't want to help you don't have to... The fact that he is asking
probably means that it is not a "devious" intent he has for the code. If he
meant to wipe out systems, there are many better ways to do it than the way
our little prankster did it a while back, languages that would hide it
better, etc.
We have a diverse group here, and some of us are salty talkers...not
all ministers, but it doesn't necessarily mean that we are bad people per
say. I have been prone to browse a hacker mag occasionally, and detest the
way they treated Kevin Mitnick, the government shouldn't hold people for
years without trial, especially citizens.
Enjoy the weekend...
Monty
