1. Adventure games
Hello all,
I have for a while been working on a adventure game project. It started out in
QBASIC and has since been ported to Euphoria. It has no story line as of yet,
since I have been mainly focusing on the game engine. The game as of now uses
color ANSI characters for graphics, but I would like to go ahead and make it 3D
isometric, similiar to "Diablo", "Starcraft" or "XCOM". I would like to add
some quality sound. And finally, I would like to make the game multiplayer and
have many players as speed will allow. This is whole lot for one person to do.
So I need help.
This is what I have so far:
1. Map sizes are 128x128 fixed. (I plan to make it variable soon.)
2. Maps are compressed to save disk space.
3. Party members can be in several maps at the same time.
4. Every entity has an inventory. (No containers as of yet.)
5. Items can picked up and dropped.
6. I have monsters, but they are stupid.(working on that)
7. Some weather and lighting effects.
8. Doors.
9. Scripting of events and objects. (Allows flexibility in game design)
10. Ability to move from map to map.
11. Automatic targeting of nearby enemys for projectile weapons.
12. Projectile weapons. (Accessed through scripting)
I'm sure there are other thing I forgot to mention. This are things that I'm
working on, but have not added to the game.
1. Enhanced AI for monsters and party members that you are not controlling.
a. If health gets low in battle and in posession of healing spell then heal
self.
b. If health of other party members is low and in posession of healing spell
then heal them.
c. If health is low and not in posession of heal spell then retreat.
d. If have nothing to fight with then retreat.(Out of ammo)
e. If enemy is visible, health is good and ammo is good then fight.
f. If not currently in a fight and other party members are, then help them.
g. Still working on the prototype.
2. Routing, going from point A to point B while avoiding obstacles.
a. Have a working prototype.
b. Occasionaly does not find point B.
c. Does not always find shortest route.
d. A bit slow on large maps.
e. Will go with a point and click interface.
Things that still need to be written:
1. A quest engine.
a. Ability to hadle multiple quests at a time.
b. Advance the story line.
2. Code to handle NPC's (merchants, barkeeps)
3. Code for all the weapons and spells.
4. Random encounters and battles.
There is probably more but I can't think of any right now.
Not only do I need help with sound and graphics I'll need help with story line.
That in itself will obviously affect the graphics and sound. I would like to
have a story line that is not necessarily linear. If the game is capable of
having multiplayer gameplay then it would need to have the ability to have more
than one quest going at a time, so different groups can go on different quests.
I have a lot to do still, but any help or suggestion would be appreciated. And
I will give credit for all the help.
Thanks
Paul Martin
2. Re: Adventure games
Paul Martin wrote:
> I have for a while been working on a adventure game project.
> This is what I have so far:
wow, a lot of stuff! u been busy ;)
> it uses color ANSI characters for graphics, but I would like to
> go ahead and make it 3D isometric
myself, and a couple others, are planning on making something
similar, but we ... ummm... well, none of us actually like
that view... heh... there is only one game i've seen that
ever had that viewpoint 'right' and that is Heroes of
Might/Magic II... guess i cannae convince u to make it
top down? (or other 'angle/view')...
> I would like to make the game multiplayer
this might be arrangable...
> 1. Enhanced AI for monsters and party members that you are not controlling.
(snip)
most of those are rather basic and easy to implement...
you may also wish to make some tests for the mobs that your
party is fighting, such that, the mob (enemy) attempts to
determine which of your party member is best for it to attack
obviously, a spell caster with leather and a broomstick would
not want to attack a titanium armored and 14ft-long-sword
wielding ogre fighter hand to hand... :)
> Things that still need to be written:
> 1. A quest engine.
> 2. Code to handle NPC's (merchants, barkeeps)
> 3. Code for all the weapons and spells.
> 4. Random encounters and battles.
--a few things i can think of that haven't been mentioned:
--ability to save/load games/plr info
--a map maker? or better, online editing (especially if multiuser)
--skills? (u mention spells/weapons...)
--pets/familiars (assist u while fighting, it's great fun to
walk around with three panthers as pets... not many mobs
or creatures like messing with you :) and having birds
for scouts to increase 'radar range')
--vehicles... boats, horses, carriages...
--legal systems (stealing, killing, mayhem! yayaya)
--political systems (there is an uprising against the dictatorship
in the 'area' 2 maps over that makes the prices for certain
items in _this_ area fluctuate, as well as the need for
player(s) to go assist (and that could then become a quest...)
>I would like to have a story line that is not necessarily linear.
positively, nothing sucks worse than 'finishing' a game and seeing
that ever-so-cheesy-let-down-of-a-grand-finale-before-dumping-to-dos.
there could be several 'large/main' quests, that provide a 'glue'
to hold the theme together, with hundreds of minor quests to
undergo to finish each main quest, as well as *bunches* of
'side' quests that advance the story none, but help your character(s)
to become richer/faster/stronger...
will post more as i think on it...
ta!
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3. Re: Adventure games
Hawke
I'm suprised that nobody liked 3D isometric, It seems like such a cool way to
play, but if more people vote no I guess I'll make it top-down. The way I have
it now is top-down, using ANSI graphics (YUK!), but it also has a 3D feel in
the way that you can walk under or behind stuff. Like if you walk directly
behind a building you will disappear as if being hidden by the building.
Yes, I will have it assign the best character for the enemy, hopefully a broom
stick won't be matched with a 14 ft broad sword. I do have a rudementary map
editor that I used to make the test maps, but it is not pretty and kinda buggy.
I do plan on being able to save games, but I would like to get the engine
completed, so I will know what all needs to be saved. I have allocated some
room in the entity data structure for skills, but I have not included them in
game play. I really like the idea of pets or familiars and I don't think it
would be hard to implement. I also like the idea of vehicles, although it may
take a little work to make work. As far legal and political systems, I will
have to wait until I am nearer to completetion, before I can see how I can make
it work. And for the finally it will depend on the story-line (I think I can
make it worth it.)
Thank you for your suggestion and please keep them coming.
Thanks
Paul Martin
4. Re: Adventure games
Hello Paul,
> I would like to go ahead and make it 3D isometric, similiar to >
"Diablo", "Starcraft" or "XCOM".
Cool!
>I would like to add some quality sound. And finally,
>I would like to make the game multiplayer and have
>many players as speed will allow.
Great Ideas
>This is whole lot for one person to do. So I need help.
No kidding.
>2. Routing, going from point A to point B while avoiding obstacles.
> a. Have a working prototype.
> b. Occasionaly does not find point B.
> c. Does not always find shortest route.
> d. A bit slow on large maps.
> e. Will go with a point and click interface.
Someone recently posted an algorithm for
somethig similar to this
>Things that still need to be written:
>
>1. A quest engine.
> a. Ability to hadle multiple quests at a time.
This of course would depend on how the rest of your game works
but here is some Ideas:
1. Quests consist of OBJECTIVES
2. When all objectives of specific quest is complete
then quest complete
3. Quests could share objectives this way.
4. some pseudocode:
constant info = 1,
initial_discription = 1,
additional_info = 2,
objectives = 2,
object = 1,
action = 2,
result = 3,
I realize this is very general but like I said, I'd have
to know how your general game engine works to be more specific.
> b. Advance the story line.
Right down my alley! I have a fantasy rpg (?) game
I've been working on for some time. About all it consists
of IS the story line. Part of the history is on my web page
(I can't remember the address but look for it in RDS's page).
I have all kinds of story ideas if you need help in this area.
>2. Code to handle NPC's (merchants, barkeeps)
Hmm.. I wouldn't mind taking a crack at it.
>3. Code for all the weapons and spells.
This too would require knowing how your game works.
>4. Random encounters and battles.
Not a problem I think.
>Not only do I need help with sound and graphics I'll need help with
>story line. That in itself will obviously affect the graphics and
>sound. I would like to have a story line that is not necessarily
>linear. If the game is capable of having multiplayer gameplay then it
>would need to have the ability to have more than one quest going at a
>time, so different groups can go on different quests.
Like I said, I'd love to help with the story (line).
linear stories in games just bug me.
I could help make graphics if I got a good editor but I'm
not too good at actually incorporating them into games.
Sincerely,
Lewis Townsend
Keroltarr at hotmail.com
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5. Re: Adventure games
Thanks for responding,
I really would like working with you on this project. As of now I am just
now completing a transition between the old game and new game. I started
this project probably a couple of years ago. I did not have high
expectations with since I started it in Qbasic. So I have been doing a lot
of porting here lately. Now I'm still expanding the ENTITIY data structure
to include things as skills, inventory, and spells. I also written a test
bed program for some AI routines that I'm expirimenting with. If you like
I will send you what I have. As of now I have no doc's for the Game
itself, and I have a little for the test bed.
I would like to see what you have as far as a story line goes. The way I
was writing the engine almost everything is scriptable. Meaning you
can walk in an area and open a trap door having monsters run at you, or
a spell can have several different effects. This I believe will allow for
a pretty imaginative storyline.
As of now the game engine is about a 25% done. It is still in ANSI graphics
YUK! Most of the scripts have not been written. Skills have not been
included until AI is more complete. AI at current time is very dumb.
Things such as species and Class has not been written. Hawke also suggested
these as well.
--ability to save/load games/plr info
--a map maker? or better, online editing (especially if multiuser)
--pets/familiars (assist u while fighting, it's great fun to
walk around with three panthers as pets... not many mobs
or creatures like messing with you :) and having birds
for scouts to increase 'radar range')
--vehicles... boats, horses, carriages...
--legal systems (stealing, killing, mayhem! yayaya)
--political systems (there is an uprising against the dictatorship
in the 'area' 2 maps over that makes the prices for certain
items in _this_ area fluctuate, as well as the need for
player(s) to go assist (and that could then become a quest...)
Most of these probably wont be a problem except for legal and political
systems. I have written a rudementary map maker, but I will clean it up
last.
I try to work on this project for at least an hour a day, so progress
seems to be slow in coming. And I will try to keep every one informed
so that if they want to join in later they can.
Thanks
Paul Martin
6. Re: Adventure games
Paul Martin wrote:
>If you like I will send you what I have.
why not post it? or... mebbe place it on a web page?
if you/we go the web page route, we can split the
engine into several 'small includes' which would let
people that wanna help work on a small portion and
divide the load that way...
xoom is imho a rather nice place to host a page, as
they only require the inclusion of a single, tiny
'button' on just one of your pages, has a modest 11m
quota, and a few goodies that can be easily added to a page.
another good one, that has been undergoing tech prog as
of late, but i believe will be resolved very shortly
is crosswinds, with no quota, at all, and no ad's
needed at all... no popups, banners, buttons... nothing.
the problem when i tried to make an account there for
Hawkes Hovel, was (unbeknownst to me) that they were
delaying activation for 48 hours because of database
problems... had i known that, i woulda waited to create
my page there, but, i didnt get a response to my request
for tech help after a modest time period (turns out they
were slammed busy trying to fix said server problem) so
i went with xoom...
i'm not real regretfull of using xoom either, and if i really
need more than 11meg, in the future, i can always use
my crosswinds account as a secondary 'sub site' containing
additional pages needed for the HHovel site.
(sorry, this may be a little off topic... i did feel that
this information may be of use to others on the listserv
making web pages for EU tho...)
>I have written a rudementary map maker,
post/publish that too, eh? in the modularity aspect i mentioned
earlier, someone could be 'singly responsible' for creating
the map maker for the 'project'....
>And I will try to keep every one informed
>so that if they want to join in later they can.
some sort of forum (which i am likly to add to HHovel, as it
will make version history documenting a lot simpler for me...)
might be useful here???
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7. Re: Adventure games
>I really would like working with you on this project. As of now I am just
>now completing a transition between the old game and new game. I started
>this project probably a couple of years ago. I did not have high
>expectations with since I started it in Qbasic. So I have been doing a lot
>of porting here lately. Now I'm still expanding the ENTITIY data structure
>to include things as skills, inventory, and spells. I also written a test
>bed program for some AI routines that I'm expirimenting with. If you like
>I will send you what I have. As of now I have no doc's for the Game
>itself, and I have a little for the test bed.
Well, yes you can sent it. But because I see/notice you are already getting
much help on this as well as the fact im not that familiar with advanture
RPG games, I will concentrate on getting it to work with the BotMatch
library, so things look good and run in every possible video resolution and
colordepth. (cga, modeX, vga, SVGA, True-Color .. thanks to Neil).
>I would like to see what you have as far as a story line goes. The way I
>was writing the engine almost everything is scriptable. Meaning you
>can walk in an area and open a trap door having monsters run at you, or
>a spell can have several different effects. This I believe will allow for
>a pretty imaginative storyline.
In the line of half-life thus, it should appear as an interactive story, but
due to smart scripting there is really no possible way to change the story
as you go through the game. (for example: you will see friends be
slaughtered by enemies, things like that) .. I will think about a good story
line, and more important how to add them to the actual game. Instead of
using triggers (which is pretty annoying to program a whole story with),
maybe a special story executor, so that every trigger is linked to a
story-line or something. That would not be too hard to implement, yet we can
have multiple triggers do the same, and have really sophisticated story
lines, and side stories.
>As of now the game engine is about a 25% done. It is still in ANSI graphics
>YUK! Most of the scripts have not been written. Skills have not been
>included until AI is more complete. AI at current time is very dumb.
>Things such as species and Class has not been written. Hawke also suggested
>these as well.
Well, I needed them in my BotMatch library, but in there there only meaning
is a collecting of graphical data (everyone is species looks the same,
although I will have support for multiple skins .. there is a trick in Neil
that easily makes this possible) and actions, say functions that can modify
the position, direction and the status package for each bot. For example it
has simple actions like move_forward, move_backward, turn_left, turn_right,
etc. The bot function is called whenever its his/her turn, but they can off
course not modify position, etc. however they can return an handle. An
action handle. Which is looked up in the action-database of the species they
are a member of, and the appropiate associated routine pointer is called.
This thus ensures that every bot within a species has equal chance and
options. The status package they also receive is not used by BotMatch,
however it can be used for many purposes by the action-routines. For example
a collision id, or a current power. Its an object so it can contain an
integer or a sequence full of data.
>--ability to save/load games/plr info
That's easy, we just use my EDOM. It stores any kind of sequence containing
any kind of information, efficiently and extremely fast. Say, its like print
() and get () however it does not produce human readable result, though its
about 10 times as fast, and stores the information about 1/100 of the size
it would otherwise take. You can also optional add your own compression or
encryption algorithm by registers the routine-pointer of you custom routine.
Edom is available at my site, at RDS' as well I think.
>--a map maker? or better, online editing (especially if multiuser)
I like a combination of made-maps (or partly made) and dynamically generated
maps. (like Diable). I have my mazer which makes a maze in either a new
sequence or in one you give him. He will respect all zero-and-below values
to be areas where he is allowed to draw walls, and all above-zero values are
considered areas where he is not allowed to draw a wall. In other words, you
can have an map, and then have a maze drawn within.
>--pets/familiars (assist u while fighting, it's great fun to
> walk around with three panthers as pets... not many mobs
> or creatures like messing with you :) and having birds
> for scouts to increase 'radar range')
Yes (btw again like half-life 
this would be nice. We need some good AI
for this though. Some smart AI.
>--vehicles... boats, horses, carriages...
This is easier than you would instantly think. Make a new species
(boats, cars, etc.) add different control, and where you take place in them,
keyboard control is sent to the other specy you own. This is a few lines in
the bot-ai of your player.
>--legal systems (stealing, killing, mayhem! yayaya)
Story/Script again.. we're talking triggers here, certain combinations
of actions-object can trigger certain reactions, for example a 'mood' chance
with the local police officers
Support for these kind of things coudl easily be added to the (now)
planned story-lines manager in BotMatch. (that handles trigges, chapters ..
(its nice to see a chapter title on the screen for half a second when you go
on a quest, or end-up in one) .. and mood-swings)
>--political systems (there is an uprising against the dictatorship
> in the 'area' 2 maps over that makes the prices for certain
> items in _this_ area fluctuate, as well as the need for
> player(s) to go assist (and that could then become a quest...)
Story/Script again.. (like above)
>Most of these probably wont be a problem except for legal and political
>systems. I have written a rudementary map maker, but I will clean it up
>last.
Yes, lets first get something up & running and look good. Then the work on
the maps/stories etc should start.
>I try to work on this project for at least an hour a day, so progress
>seems to be slow in coming. And I will try to keep every one informed
>so that if they want to join in later they can.
Thats, ok. It seems we have a few different areas currently.
BotMatch- Maps, Story-lines, Triggers, Actors, Species, Bots. (bots are thus
part of a species. For example human, could have an bot that is aggresive, a
bot that is user-controlled (keyboard), however because it are bots they all
can do the same things.
So, the above it the mamager and actual executor, however, we need a couple
more libraries off course.
One is what you are actually working on, though in a different 'format'.
It should handle:
-- generating/loading up the maps.
-- registering species (humans, wolves, aliens, whatever) and thus their
actions. (those actions take the most code I think, having a player walk, an
alien fly, etc.)
-- loading & registering storyline, and routines associated to certain
triggers. (gives us more freedom)
So, actually the above is the game-specific library. Which is logical
because BotMatch currently is, and I will keep it like that, a generic
purpose tile-game-engine that at least ensures easy use with custom bots,
that are not capable of accesing any information they are not allowed to
know (no cheating thus)
What else is needed ?
Later on, you will need an interface library. A simple start/option screen,
etc.
A map-maker. What is left zero or below zero is filled it by maze properties
we choose, so certain parts can be 100% maps, and certain parts can be 5 to
10% dynamic.
Ok, I'll see and tell you what Ive got wednesday evening..
Ralf
8. Re: Adventure games
Ralf
I'll be looking forward to your doc's. BTW I'm not having much luck running
GAME.EX,
although GAME.EXE works fine. It says something about invalid routine id, I
enclosed
EX.ERR.
Thanks
Paul Martin
9. Re: Adventure games
- Posted by Ralf Nieuwenhuijsen <nieuwen at XS4ALL.NL>
Dec 15, 1998
-
Last edited Dec 16, 1998
>I'll be looking forward to your doc's. BTW I'm not having much luck running
>GAME.EX,
>although GAME.EXE works fine. It says something about invalid routine id, I
>enclosed
>EX.ERR.
Interesting, what version of BotMatch are you using ?
The version from my site, or the one I sent per email.
I just went to 'Sent Items', clicked on the mail I sent, opened the attached
zip (which simply looks like a 'map' due to zipmagic which I use, and I
launch game.ex .. works fine for me)
Maybe, Ive uploaded a bad version to my website, or if you are using the zip
file I sent you by email, we really got a problem.
Which version of Euphoria are you using ? I know that 2alpha had some issues
with routine pointers when they are not declared global.
Its easy to check this, go into keyboard.bot and lucius2.bot and make the
run_kbbot, init_kbbot and run_lbot (or something) and init_lbot ... make
them *global* rather than *local* they will currently not conflict with any
other name. If this does not crash, you are (maybe by accident) using
Euphoria 2 - alpha. Get the latest at RDS' website.
Ralf
